| |
Discussion: Who's a legend & who's an icon?
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 8,890
|
Quote:
Originally posted by ItsJim
why are y'all so bothered with Britney being a LEGEND?it's a fact, get over it.
 |
Exactly. They seem so bothered.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 4/23/2012
Posts: 16,691
|
Janet isn't a legend either. Neither is Whitney.
Madonna, Michael, Mariah, Celine and Beyonce are the only legends.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 32,982
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Toxicity.
Britney was at one time great [10 years ago], that's called a fad not a legend, now all she does is tarnish her already damaged legacy with every move she makes. She is no way a legend. She does not command respect from anyone in the industry. Just pity.
Beyonce on the other hand continues to add iconic moments and accolades to her already impressive career. Hell, even Xtina is still adding hits and giving births to careers.
|
I get it; you're still upset nobody thanked you for buying and gifting "Work B**ch" ten times the day it came out. The fact that your name is "Toxicity" and you were just one of the millions of pop forum users who were birthed by her legacy doesn't really help your argument.
Michael Jackson spent the final decades of his life fighting skin bleaching accusations, accusations of pedophilia, rhinoplasty issues, etc. and his legacy didn't go anywhere. Britney hasn't done anything to tarnish her career like Madonna, Elvis, Michael Jackson, The Beatles (*hint* John & Yoko *hint*), etc. have. In fact, it seems to be that most legends have a tumultuous later stage in life and Britney is just one of many.
Beyonce hasn't done anything iconic in as long as Britney. As for Christina's last iconic moment, well..... Just because Beyonce still actively promotes (as does Christina) does not mean they're magically legends. As for them adding more accolades to their careers, good. Still, they're going to need to a lot more accolades if they even want to be on the same level as Britney is right now.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 3/11/2011
Posts: 1,716
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Toxicity.
Janet isn't a legend either. Neither is Whitney.
Madonna, Michael, Mariah, Celine and Beyonce are the only legends. |
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 8,890
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Toxicity.
Stop with the Wikipedia receipts. Plenty of people are inspired by others before them. Still doesn't make Britney a legend. A legend is respected by her industry not just female pop stars after her. She's not. |
It doesn't matter where the receipts came from, it doesn't change the fact that those artists said it. And obviously she is respected by the industry, because she has the awards and recognition to prove it. And it isn't just pop stars that respect her...
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 32,982
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Chimier
Uh....no.
Induct (v.): to admit formally to a position or organization.
Add (v.): join (something) to something else so as to increase the size, number, or amount.
Because they are NOT comparable. The Hall of FAME is established to celebrate specific music acts who changed the industry through musical excellence. The Library was established because the Hall of Fame foundation desired to create a place where people could get material from the rock and roll era for personal or academic use.
You're welcome.
|
...I really hope you can see that "induct" and "add" are synonyms from that definition.
And why do you think they choose what goes in to the Library and Archives instead of just throwing everything released in there? You're not creating an argument that signifies that just any album/music/song is thrown in there for the sake of having a tourist attraction.
Quote:
Originally posted by Toxicity.
Stop with the Wikipedia receipts. Plenty of people are inspired by others before them. Still doesn't make Britney a legend. A legend is respected by her industry not just female pop stars after her. She's not. |
Britney is actually respected by songwriters whereas Beyonce and Madonna are not. Shouldn't they be removed then if "respect" is all that matters for legend status? 
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 4/23/2012
Posts: 16,691
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Eternium
I get it; you're still upset nobody thanked you for buying and gifting "Work B**ch" ten times the day it came out. The fact that your name is "Toxicity" and you were just one of the millions of pop forum users who were birthed by her legacy doesn't really help your argument.
Michael Jackson spent the final decades of his life fighting skin bleaching accusations, accusations of pedophilia, rhinoplasty issues, etc. and his legacy didn't go anywhere. Britney hasn't done anything to tarnish her career like Madonna, Elvis, Michael Jackson, The Beatles (*hint* John & Yoko *hint*), etc. have. In fact, it seems to be that most legends have a tumultuous later stage in life and Britney is just one of many.
Beyonce hasn't done anything iconic in as long as Britney. As for Christina's last iconic moment, well..... Just because Beyonce still actively promotes (as does Christina) does not mean they're magically legends. As for them adding more accolades to their careers, good. Still, they're going to need to a lot more accolades if they even want to be on the same level as Britney is right now.
|
Not you thinking Britney is higher up than Beyonce at this point in time. Oh child. There is no comparison. MJ, Madonna, Elvis, and all those other LEGENDS you mentioned had their talent and industry respect to fall back on. People still respected and loved them for their talent. Do you really think the majority of [GP] people nowadays still think of Britney in high regard? You're in for a shock. And why would you even dare compare Britney, teen pop sensation, to LEGENDS like MJ, Maonna, Elvis. Beyond me.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 1,369
|
Quote:
Originally posted by TheNotebook
impossible to list legends without the following names
Aretha Franklin-inspired every singer after
James Brown
Prince
MJ
Stevie Wonder
Whitney
Madonna
Janet
Mariah-the last living legend.
the ones after Mariah are icons.
|
Most of these artists are in their 40s & up. In order for people to be considered Legends, there needs to be some type of nostalgia. I think Beyonce's name will be mentioned in 15 years or so. Not now. For now, Christina, Britney Spears, and Beyonce are considered icons. I don't think Britney and Christina will be considered legends in the long run but I may be wrong.
I am wondering what P!NK will be considered in the long run. She is doing extremely well with career longevity.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 28,773
|
My man is an icon, soon to be a legend.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 4/23/2012
Posts: 16,691
|
Quote:
Originally posted by geddymonster
It doesn't matter where the receipts came from, it doesn't change the fact that those artists said it. And obviously she is respected by the industry, because she has the awards and recognition to prove it. And it isn't just pop stars that respect her...
|
Teen Choice Awards? That People's Choice Award she got the other day for attending for 20 min?
That's not the type of industry respect I was looking for.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 3/11/2011
Posts: 1,716
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Eternium
...I really hope you can see that "induct" and "add" are synonyms from that definition.
|
The only thing I see is that the process of induction includes addition. This doesn't mean the words are synonymous. Just like if a boss fires a worker, he is subtracting from his workforce, but the words "fire" and "subtract" are not synonymous.
Quote:
Originally posted by Eternium
And why do you think they choose what goes in to the Library and Archives instead of just throwing everything released in there? You're not creating an argument that signifies that just any album/music/song is thrown in there for the sake of having a tourist attraction.
|
Really? The Library and Archives have a copy of Could I Have This Kiss Forever by Whitney Houston and Enrique Iglesias. That song was clearly a significant body of work, important to the musical, social and cultural aesthetic. Or what about Nelly's album Brass Knuckles? That's in the Library and Archives also! Clearly an album of great significance!
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 4/23/2012
Posts: 16,691
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Eternium
Britney is actually respected by songwriters whereas Beyonce and Madonna are not. Shouldn't they be removed then if "respect" is all that matters for legend status? |
You're really coming for writing credits when Britney Jean's songwriting credits are more questionable than anything Beyonce has ever done.
Which songwriters respect her? 
Beyonce has actually won an award from the ASCAP for Songwriter of the Year, you know, the most important composer rights organization. DO NOT TRY IT dear Eternium.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 32,982
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Toxicity.
Not you thinking Britney is higher up than Beyonce at this point in time. Oh child. There is no comparison. MJ, Madonna, Elvis, and all those other LEGENDS you mentioned had their talent and industry respect to fall back on. People still respected and loved them for their talent. Do you really think the majority of [GP] people nowadays still think of Britney in high regard? You're in for a shock. And why would you even dare compare Britney, teen pop sensation, to LEGENDS like MJ, Maonna, Elvis. Beyond me.
|
As a solo artist, Beyonce is on Rihanna's level. When you include Beyoncé's group work, she's globally around Shakira's level and the #2 female artist of her generation only behind Britney.
Madonna is less talented than Britney and so is Elvis. Neither of the two are even strong performers. They're both legends for their innovations in performing and music marketing. If you're really talking about talent, shouldn't you only have dancing operatic singers listed, AKA nobody that's ever succeeded in pop music?
Ironically, you make this case for talent yet argue that Whitney isn't a legend.
The GP doesn't think of Madonna, MJ or Elvis in high regards, either. If you mention Elvis to someone, the first thing they're bound to say is going to be in a lame accent followed by a joke about him dying on the toilet. If you mention MJ, you're going to get a child molestation joke or a rhinoplasty joke. You can even go on to Facebook now and see the people who questioned whether Madonna was alive or not at the Grammy's and 95% of all posts bash her for trying to cling to newer musical acts and the gays to get a career resurgence. I don't agree with any of this, but that's what the GP thinks. So why would Britney be below them because she also has a negative reputation just like them?
Quote:
Originally posted by Toxicity.
Teen Choice Awards? That People's Choice Award she got the other day for attending for 20 min?
That's not the type of industry respect I was looking for.
|
Would the award count more if her dad opened a record label so she could sweep genre-specific categories at other award shows she shouldn't even be eligible for? Lbr, you're in no place to try and discredit anyone else's awards when the ones you're hiding behind are unscrupulous.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 32,982
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Toxicity.
You're really coming for writing credits when Britney Jean's songwriting credits are more questionable than anything Beyonce has ever done.
Which songwriters respect her?
Beyonce has actually won an award from the ASCAP for Songwriter of the Year, you know, the most important composer rights organization. DO NOT TRY IT dear Eternium.
|
Beyonce has songwriting credits for "Amor Gitano," a song in Spanish that was written before Alejandro Fernandez even pitched it to her I actually followed Beyonce from 1998-2008 so you're not going to pull any wool from my eyes 
Heather Brighton, whom I can name off the top of my head, among the other songwriters who didn't just get $2,000 for writing a hit song.
And Milli Vanilli won a Grammy. The only difference is they weren't a marketable brand with hundreds of millions resting on them so their accolade was revoked.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 4/23/2012
Posts: 16,691
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Eternium
As a solo artist, Beyonce is on Rihanna's level. When you include Beyoncé's group work, she's globally around Shakira's level and the #2 female artist of her generation only behind Britney.
Madonna is less talented than Britney and so is Elvis. Neither of the two are even strong performers. They're both legends for their innovations in performing and music marketing. If you're really talking about talent, shouldn't you only have dancing operatic singers listed, AKA nobody that's ever succeeded in pop music?
Ironically, you make this case for talent yet argue that Whitney isn't a legend.
The GP doesn't think of Madonna, MJ or Elvis in high regards, either. If you mention Elvis to someone, the first thing they're bound to say is going to be in a lame accent followed by a joke about him dying on the toilet. If you mention MJ, you're going to get a child molestation joke or a rhinoplasty joke. You can even go on to Facebook now and see the people who questioned whether Madonna was alive or not at the Grammy's and 95% of all posts bash her for trying to cling to newer musical acts and the gays to get a career resurgence. I don't agree with any of this, but that's what the GP thinks. So why would Britney be below them because she also has a negative reputation just like them?
Would the award count more if her dad opened a record label so she could sweep genre-specific categories at other award shows she shouldn't even be eligible for? Lbr, you're in no place to try and discredit anyone else's awards when the ones you're hiding behind are unscrupulous.
|
I cannot continue arguing with someone who is convinced that Britney, AT THE POINT IN TIME, is more respected and at higher level than BEYONCE. 
Quote:
|
Madonna is less talented than Britney and so is Elvis. Neither of the two are even strong performers.
|
 sig worthy, but it's expected of you to say something so ludicrous so it kinda takes away from the sig worth.
Stopped reading after this. Britney is not a legend, nor will she be. No TCA, KCA, PCA or any other CAs is gonna change that
Good day.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 3/11/2011
Posts: 1,716
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Eternium
Beyonce has songwriting credits for "Amor Gitano," a song in Spanish that was written before Alejandro Fernandez even pitched it to her I actually followed Beyonce from 1998-2008 so you're not going to pull any wool from my eyes
Heather Brighton, whom I can name off the top of my head, among the other songwriters who didn't just get $2,000 for writing a hit song.
And Milli Vanilli won a Grammy. The only difference is they weren't a marketable brand with hundreds of millions resting on them so their accolade was revoked. |
Milli Vanilli's accolade was revoked because they weren't actually the ones singing on their record.....
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 32,982
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Toxicity.
I cannot continue arguing with someone who is convinced that Britney, AT THE POINT IN TIME, is more respected and at higher level than BEYONCE.
sig worthy, but it's expected of you to say something so ludicrous so it kinda takes away from the sig worth.
Stopped reading after this. Britney is not a legend, nor will she be. No TCA, KCA, PCA or any other CAs is gonna change that
Good day.
|
I'm talking about Britney's overall career. This is a thread about legacy so why are you trying so hard to discredit Britney's career like Britney Jean is all that counts? I even said Britney isn't respected. Do you need help reading my posts because I can send them in sound bytes to try and help you?
Have you seen Elvis and Madonna perform? Madonna had a considerably weaker voice than Britney for the most successful parts of her career and even after extensive vocal training for Evita still is not a very good singer by any stretch of the imagination. Her dancing skills are nothing compared to Britney. You're the one who thinks her legacy comes from her talent and not from her innovation in sexual/religious imagery and the use of music videos as a promotional tool in place of WW concerts (which is an undeniable fact, Madonna has said so herself).
Elvis was also not a strong dancer, though he was very notable for his hook choreographies (i.e. the grinding). His voice isn't very strong, either, though he does have a notable tone. His legend status comes from the popularization of rock n'roll and the mixing of the genre with sexual imagery (the grinding) and trendy clothing.
Welcome to Music History 101.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/22/2010
Posts: 12,270
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Eternium
Beyonce has songwriting credits for "Amor Gitano," a song in Spanish that was written before Alejandro Fernandez even pitched it to her I actually followed Beyonce from 1998-2008 so you're not going to pull any wool from my eyes
. |
Wait. Is this true?  
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/18/2013
Posts: 2,654
|
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 8,890
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Toxicity.
Teen Choice Awards? That People's Choice Award she got the other day for attending for 20 min?
That's not the type of industry respect I was looking for.
|
She has a Michael Jackson Video Vanguard Award, something Beyoncé is currently lacking at the moment. She also has a Grammy award, which is something that many artists are lacking.
|
|
|
|
|
|
