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Celeb News: Madonna Voted #1 - Artists Who Have Helped The LGBT Movement
Member Since: 6/9/2011
Posts: 1,560
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Quote:
Originally posted by swissman
You had said, "it's more absurd with straight when they know that they are attractive to male or female at puberty." This would imply that gay people do not know they are attracted to the same sex at puberty. However, your sentence structure is odd and I take it English is not your first language so it's possible I've misunderstood.
If you're black and not respected by society I don't see how it's different from being gay and not respected by society. Either way you need to be proud of who you are. The drag queen line does not imply Gaga thinks all gays are drag queens. She's met enough gay men to know the difference. It is a play on words. "Don't be a drag" means "don't be depressed" and "just be a queen" means "just be proudly gay". The combination of the words is her adding wit to the music. It's pop after all. And you've ignored the entire bridge where she names all the types of person you can be that are not just drag queens.
Click here for the google search. |
Quote:
Originally posted by swissman
You had said, "it's more absurd with straight when they know that they are attractive to male or female at puberty." This would imply that gay people do not know they are attracted to the same sex at puberty. However, your sentence structure is odd and I take it English is not your first language so it's possible I've misunderstood.
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you imply too much, that's why i ask you to stop drawing out the subtle development from what i said
Quote:
Originally posted by swissman
If you're black and not respected by society I don't see how it's different from being gay and not respected by society. Either way you need to be proud of who you are. The drag queen line does not imply Gaga thinks all gays are drag queens. She's met enough gay men to know the difference. It is a play on words. "Don't be a drag" means "don't be depressed" and "just be a queen" means "just be proudly gay". The combination of the words is her adding wit to the music. It's pop after all. And you've ignored the entire bridge where she names all the types of person you can be that are not just drag queens.
Click here for the google search. |
if you're black or ugly and not respected by society somehow it lead you to changing your appearance by doing plastic surgery or bleaching your skin ect ect but if you're gay and not respected by society it doesn't lead you to change your sexual orientation because sexual desire is great, you feel great when look at a beautiful man and wish that you could have sex with that guy, your sexual desire is like cocain ( this is right to both gay and straight ) society says that it's weird ( to gay ) and sometime a sin ( to straight ), but none of us want to annihilate our sexual desire because it's not like a skin or an beautiful face which make you proud of while your desire is a natural thing. you needs someone to encourage you that your color kin is beautiful, your face is beautiful but it's unnecessary with your sexual orientation
i dont see that line in BTW is play word though, with a person with a rich imagination like you, it can be implied in any way and even if It is a play on words, that metaphors still sounds nonsense because drags are the most proudly kind of gay and belong to openly gay people so dont need to be queens anymore
you gave me the link of gay people who experiencing the time in conversion camps ( mostly is awful and full of Crying ) but you dont know how did they get into those conversion camps, they're forced by family not voluntary.
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Member Since: 6/9/2011
Posts: 1,560
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rusty
Let me fix for you.
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none of Madonna fans mentioned her name in this thread first, the OP doesn't even have nothing related to her, so what is your point ?
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 16,371
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FAO: Ulquiorra Allen
Quote:
Originally posted by Rusty
Only gay people can champion gays and gay rights? News to me. Because Gaga does it, what, more outrageously or less ambiguously she can't do it, but Madonna can? Or Christina? Or Macklemore, whose song is more black-and-white gay-acceptance anthem-themed song than any Lady Gaga song?
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Quote:
Originally posted by Nhật Thực
which ego of Madonna are you referring to ? outrageous Madonna or feminine Madonna ? she used to be hated in 80s for being outrageous but unlike lady gaga,she know how to reinvent herself to taking back the love from society so dont compare her to lady gaga, and Mackelmore doesn't mention gays as much as lady gaga, she keeps mentions gays just for a reason
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It was in response to this reply, which showed inconsistency and double standards by the user my comment relied to. Keep up if you're going to attempt calling out.
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Member Since: 6/2/2011
Posts: 28,055
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Macklemore, seriously? 
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Member Since: 3/27/2012
Posts: 18,963
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ulquiorra Allen
if you're black or ugly and not respected by society somehow it lead you to changing your appearance by doing plastic surgery or bleaching your skin ect ect but if you're gay and not respected by society it doesn't lead you to change your sexual orientation because sexual desire is great, you feel great when look at a beautiful man and wish that you could have sex with that guy, your sexual desire is like cocain ( this is right to both gay and straight ) society says that it's weird ( to gay ) and sometime a sin ( to straight ), but none of us want to annihilate our sexual desire because it's not like a skin or an beautiful face which make you proud of while your desire is a natural thing. you needs someone to encourage you that your color kin is beautiful, your face is beautiful but it's unnecessary with your sexual orientation
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Sorry but not every black person bleaches their skin. Not every person insecure with their looks gets plastic surgery. What are you even talking about? And like I said, there are plenty of places you can go to try and make yourself straight. They fail, but they do exist. Furthermore, why do you think people stay in the closet? Because they feel great whenever they look at another person of the same sex and find them attractive or because they are ashamed of the feelings? I think this should be the last post I direct at you because you're just making things up. And for what purpose? To somehow prove that BTW isn't a gay anthemn and therefore Gaga is nothing for the gays? What is your point? If you did not get anything out of BTW that's fine. But it's a fact that others have. I did. There's one.
Quote:
Originally posted by Ulquiorra Allen
i dont see that line in BTW is play word though, with a person with a rich imagination like you, it can be implied in any way and even if It is a play on words, that metaphors still sounds nonsense because drags are the most proudly kind of gay and belong to openly gay people so dont need to be queens anymore
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Imagination has nothing to do with it. That line is not saying "Don't be a drag [queen] be gay". I'm sure everyone can agree on the very obvious wordplay that leaves very little to be imagined.
Quote:
Originally posted by Ulquiorra Allen
you gave me the link of gay people who experiencing the time in conversion camps ( mostly is awful and full of Crying ) but you dont know how did they get into those conversion camps, they're forced by family not voluntary.
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You're right. Most are forced to go, but there are willing participants. Due to the gay rights movement there are less gays who feel so ashamed of themselves, but that number isn't the discussion here.
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 27,490
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Demi Lovato 
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Member Since: 6/9/2011
Posts: 1,560
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Quote:
Originally posted by swissman
Sorry but not every black person bleaches their skin. Not every person insecure with their looks gets plastic surgery. What are you even talking about? And like I said, there are plenty of places you can go to try and make yourself straight. They fail, but they do exist. Furthermore, why do you think people stay in the closet? Because they feel great whenever they look at another person of the same sex and find them attractive or because they are ashamed of the feelings? I think this should be the last post I direct at you because you're just making things up. And for what purpose? To somehow prove that BTW isn't a gay anthemn and therefore Gaga is nothing for the gays? What is your point? If you did not get anything out of tBTWhat's fine. But it's a fact that others have. I did. There's one.
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of course not EVERY, i honestly can't understand why you imply what i said in that way.
"ashamed of the feelings" ? are you christian ? i always require people to show me the proof for what they say, the problem of you is that you conjecture too much. yes i have no doubt to say that she's nothing to gay but a exploiter and she can't blind it forever specially to people who smart enought to understand her purpose behind what she's done for gays, luckily, i'm not the only one http://variety.com/2014/data/news/ga...es-1201262946/
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You're right. Most are forced to go, but there are willing participants. Due to the gay rights movement there are less gays who feel so ashamed of themselves, but that number isn't the discussion here
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ashamed of being gay for many reasons which caused by the pressure from society, family, school not about sexual-acceptance, why ? i explained it in last post but you keep being fail at understand the difference between sexual acceptance and self expression
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Imagination has nothing to do with it. That line is not saying "Don't be a drag [queen] be gay". I'm sure everyone can agree on the very obvious wordplay that leaves very little to be imagined.
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ask the monsters and you will get empathy from them, dont tell me anymore about your deduction of wordplay because i dont see it
i should be the one ask you this question
you shouldn't be bother to quote and reply me at the begining, i dont need you or any lady gaga stans improving my point of view on her, just care your work.
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Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 32,982
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Terrible list, though Madonna is definitely #1. Wtf is Dolly Parton? And people always forget Madonna was not the first LGBT-focused artist and there were musicians before the 80s that worked for gay rights.
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Member Since: 10/10/2011
Posts: 14,321
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Gaga didn't alienate her audience for this.
Jokes aside, I do think Gaga deserves to be on the list, her fans have listed a well amount of reasons why so I don't think I have to elaborate.
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Member Since: 3/27/2012
Posts: 18,963
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ulquiorra Allen
of course not EVERY, i honestly can't understand why you imply what i said in that way.
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The proof is in your own words. I admit I should not have said "every". Instead I should say "every black person who is not respected" because that is what you said, and also that is completely untrue. Your sentence very clearly states that you think if you're black and not respected you bleach your skin.
" if you're black or ugly and not respected by society somehow it lead you to changing your appearance by doing plastic surgery or bleaching your skin"
Quote:
Originally posted by Ulquiorra Allen
ashamed of being gay for many reasons which caused by the pressure from society, family, school not about sexual-acceptance, why ? i explained it in last post but you keep being fail at understand the difference between sexual acceptance and self expression
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I know the difference, do you know the similarities?
Quote:
Originally posted by Ulquiorra Allen
i should be the one ask you this question
you shouldn't be bother to quote and reply me at the begining, i dont need you or any lady gaga stans improving my point of view on her, just care your work.
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My point is that Lady Gaga has written a song that celebrates being gay. Whether you think her intentions were pure or not really matters little so long as what she has created has affected people positively, and there is no argument to say that it has not.
The sad part is that instead of letting something positive happen you're tearing it down.
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Member Since: 2/28/2012
Posts: 19,176
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Quote:
Originally posted by Eternium
Terrible list, though Madonna is definitely #1. Wtf is Dolly Parton? And people always forget Madonna was not the first LGBT-focused artist and there were musicians before the 80s that worked for gay rights.
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who are you talking about?
i didn't know anybody at least no one who was that big and influential during the 80s.
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Member Since: 3/27/2012
Posts: 18,963
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Quote:
Originally posted by Lover
who are you talking about?
i didn't know anybody at least no one who was that big and influential during the 80s.
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There definitely are others but none were as big as Madonna.
For example, Bette Midler used to do a lot of performances in gay bathhouses in the 1970s. So much so that she was nicknamed Bathhouse Betty.
Then there are examples like Freddie Mercury and Sylvester who were.. but ya no on touched Madonna's level of visibility and support.
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Member Since: 6/9/2011
Posts: 1,560
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Quote:
Originally posted by swissman
The proof is in your own words. I admit I should not have said "every". Instead I should say "every black person who is not respected" because that is what you said, and also that is completely untrue. Your sentence very clearly states that you think if you're black and not respected you bleach your skin.
"if you're black or ugly and not respected by society somehow it lead you to changing your appearance by doing plastic surgery or bleaching your skin"
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which sentence did i use the word " every " ? reach
Quote:
Originally posted by swissman
I know the difference, do you know the similarities?
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no, i can't know about thing that doesn't exist
Quote:
Originally posted by swissman
My point is that Lady Gaga has written a song that celebrates being gay. Whether you think her intentions were pure or not really matters little so long as what she has created has affected people positively, and there is no argument to say that it has not.
The sad part is that instead of letting something positive happen you're tearing it down.
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lol, i dont feel sad about that, how can i feel happy for an artist exploiting gay to sell music.
did it really affect people positively ? so i just ask you a question : there're how many gay guys come out after listening to that song ?
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Member Since: 3/27/2012
Posts: 18,963
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ulquiorra Allen
which sentence did i use the word " every " ? reach
no, i can't know about thing that doesn't exist
lol, i dont feel sad about that, how can i feel happy for an artist exploiting gay to sell music.
did it really affect people positively ? so i just ask you a question : there're how many gay guys come out after listening to that song ?
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You do not have to say the word for it to be implied. For example, if a sentence said, " if you are an apple, you are red." That would imply that every apple is red. You don't need to say it if you word it like that.
The similarity of self-expression and self-acceptance is that both of them requires you to know yourself and be confident enough to share it with the world.
I don't think anyone ever took a study about people coming out because of BTW, but I surely felt more comfortable being gay with a song on the radio at #1, talking about how normal gay is. It is far more likely that young men heard it and that it helped them too than that it sunk them further into self-hatred. Do you really think it did more harm than good?
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Member Since: 5/8/2012
Posts: 6,632
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ulquiorra Allen
which sentence did i use the word " every " ? reach
no, i can't know about thing that doesn't exist
lol, i dont feel sad about that, how can i feel happy for an artist exploiting gay to sell music.
did it really affect people positively ? so i just ask you a question : there're how many gay guys come out after listening to that song ?
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Why are you so dead-set on the idea that Gaga must be "exploiting" the gay community? Just because she mentions them a lot doesn't mean she's using them.  And it's not like "using the gays" has done wonders for her career lol
BTW (the single) made me feel better about myself as a gross, insecure 13 y/o, for one. I still remember the day it came out 
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Member Since: 3/27/2012
Posts: 18,963
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Quote:
Originally posted by Butters
Why are you so dead-set on the idea that Gaga must be "exploiting" the gay community? Just because she mentions them a lot doesn't mean she's using them. And it's not like "using the gays" has done wonders for her career lol
BTW (the single) made me feel better about myself as a gross, insecure 13 y/o, for one. I still remember the day it came out |
Even if she was exploiting the gay community, I'd rather have someone say "If I make a song about gays, start a charity and raise lots of money for gay-related causes, go make speeches about gay rights around the world, dedicate things to them, talk about them in interviews, be a role model for them, and teach them to love themselves, I will make millions" than have none of that good done at all.
Like who cares about anyone's motive so long as they're doing something genuinely positive?
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Member Since: 5/8/2012
Posts: 6,632
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Quote:
Originally posted by swissman
Even if she was exploiting the gay community, I'd rather have someone say "If I make a song about gays, start a charity and raise lots of money for gay-related causes, go make speeches about gay rights around the world, dedicate things to them, talk about them in interviews, be a role model for them, and teach them to love themselves, I will make millions" than have none of that good done at all.
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I remember a few months ago JB dropped 600k at a fundraiser (at a time when he was receiving horrible press (racism, dui) and everyone was like "he's only doing it to look good to the public"
It's still a generous amount of money an I'm sure the people at the charity were happy and grateful, regardless of his "true intentions"...
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Member Since: 6/9/2011
Posts: 1,560
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Quote:
Originally posted by swissman
You do not have to say the word for it to be implied. For example, if a sentence said, "if you are an apple, you are red." That would imply that every apple is red. You don't need to say it if you word it like that.
The similarity of self-expression and self-acceptance is that both of them requires you to know yourself and be confident enough to share it with the world.
I don't think anyone ever took a study about people coming out because of BTW, but I surely felt more comfortable being gay with a song on the radio at #1, talking about how normal gay is. It is far more likely that young men heard it and that it helped them too than that it sunk them further into self-hatred. Do you really think it did more harm than good?
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imply again.
not every apple is red as well as not every black man feel ashamed about their color
of course, a boy will know that he's gay or not when the puberty come, in some case, it's later for a man to know that he's gay at middleage, but that's the matter of time, it's more like self-discovery rather than self-acceptance, i think thta's what you're confused so let alone self-expressing
what would happen if i's not peak at #1 ?
the pressure from society, family, school makes a gay guy feel ashamed not their sexual orientation, from inside, they feel comfortable for loving this is self-acceptance
but it's not comfortable to come out, this is self-expressing
the pressure from society makes gay people ashamed and weak, specially young boys. the weakness makes them feeble in deducing. it's like A a kid starving on street then suddenly there's another guy B coming and give A food and maintain him, A was thinking that B was good until A know that B just maintained then sell him for an illegal kidney trading service in china.
lady's case is not that serious but somehow it's similar in the way she exploiting gay to sell music
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 16,371
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ulquiorra Allen
lol, i dont feel sad about that, how can i feel happy for an artist exploiting gay to sell music.
did it really affect people positively ? so i just ask you a question : there're how many gay guys come out after listening to that song ?
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BTW, more the messages of the era than the song itself, helped me come out to people I didn't think I'd ever tell I was gay. Quantifying "how many gays came out" is as stupid as the rest of your comments in here. Born This Way was a positive thing for the gay community; Lady Gaga, a star who, at the time, was the biggest artist on the planet who was going to open with her 2M week WW regardless of her theme, literally pitched her earned popularity on gay rights and self-acceptance in a more general sense as her dogma. Stop acting like it was some secret plan for exploitation when the move has cost her more than it has earned her commercially.
Nobody here is saying she did more than Madonna or deserves to be #1, but the omission from that floppy list is glaring with people like Demi Lovato on it.
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Member Since: 6/9/2011
Posts: 1,560
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Quote:
Originally posted by Butters
Why are you so dead-set on the idea that Gaga must be "exploiting" the gay community? Just because she mentions them a lot doesn't mean she's using them. And it's not like "using the gays" has done wonders for her career lol
BTW (the single) made me feel better about myself as a gross, insecure 13 y/o, for one. I still remember the day it came out |
Quote:
Originally posted by swissman
Even if she was exploiting the gay community, I'd rather have someone say "If I make a song about gays, start a charity and raise lots of money for gay-related causes, go make speeches about gay rights around the world, dedicate things to them, talk about them in interviews, be a role model for them, and teach them to love themselves, I will make millions" than have none of that good done at all.
Like who cares about anyone's motive so long as they're doing something genuinely positive?
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that's good, seem like you find out a gaga stan that identify with you
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