Yes, this thread is a mess.
When someone says "voice of a generation", I immediatelly think of Nevermind and Never Mind The Bollocks - two albums that shook the ground, started some kind of movement and were seen as a statement of artists who thanks to them became voices of their generation and have huge, lasting impact on music and culture.
People who were arguing whether Katy or Gaga is the voice of our generation often have no idea what the "voice of a generation" actually is and used wrong arguments.
1, The voice of a generation is not defined by numbers and certainly not by money. It doesnt really matter who has won more awards, sold more records or whose tour grossed more. For example Elton John, Tom Jones or Celine Dion outsold almost all stars in the music industry, but are they known as "voice of a generation"? No. Why? Because their music is not challenging anything, nor changed anything.
2, The argument that "voice of our generation" must have a good voice is stupid. Artists like Kurt Cobain, Bob Dylan or Johnny Rotten are certainly not known for their vocal abilities, but their creativity, style and songwriting.
3, Katy Perry stans think she is the voice of our generation because her music is liked by broader range of people (including old people and little kids). The problem is that people like Katy because they dont have any problems with her. She and her generic pop music is not very controversial. Katy just goes with the flow and doesnt evoke strong feelings.
Voices of generations always caused passionate reactions, were very outspoken, polarizing, provoking and pushed boundaries. Those artists were always going against the flow, what made them unique and outstanding.
4, Gaga stans argumented that she is the voice of our generation because of her massive charity work, because she uses her popularity for greater good... sorry, but this has nothing to do with it. To be a voice of a generation means that you will become something like a mirror of the society. Artists known as the voices of generations just accentuated the problems of society they live in and frustration of people with current situation. Their music just reflects the atmosphere of their time, nothing more and nothing less.
Also Gagas gay rights activism has nothing to do with this. The fight for gay rights and equality has a long history, its not an issue which specifies this generation. And todays society is much more open minded and supportive of gay rights, so its not like to support LGBT movement is seen as something scandalous or provocative anymore, like it was 20 years ago. When you are supporting gay rights, you can become a gay icon (like many pop stars before), but it will not make you a voice of a generation.
Yes, this thread is a mess.
When someone says "voice of a generation", I immediatelly think of Nevermind and Never Mind The Bollocks - two albums that shook the ground, started some kind of movement and were seen as a statement of artists who thanks to them became voices of their generation and have huge, lasting impact on music and culture.
People who were arguing whether Katy or Gaga is the voice of our generation often have no idea what the "voice of a generation" actually is and used wrong arguments.
1, The voice of a generation is not defined by numbers and certainly not by money. It doesnt really matter who has won more awards, sold more records or whose tour grossed more. For example Elton John, Tom Jones or Celine Dion outsold almost all stars in the music industry, but are they known as "voice of a generation"? No. Why? Because their music is not challenging anything, nor changed anything.
2, The argument that "voice of our generation" must have a good voice is stupid. Artists like Kurt Cobain, Bob Dylan or Johnny Rotten are certainly not known for their vocal abilities, but their creativity, style and songwriting.
3, Katy Perry stans think she is the voice of our generation because her music is liked by broader range of people (including old people and little kids). The problem is that people like Katy because they dont have any problems with her. She and her generic pop music is not very controversial. Katy just goes with the flow and doesnt evoke strong feelings.
Voices of generations always caused passionate reactions, were very outspoken, polarizing, provoking and pushed boundaries. Those artists were always going against the flow, what made them unique and outstanding.
4, Gaga stans argumented that she is the voice of our generation because of her massive charity work, because she uses her popularity for greater good... sorry, but this has nothing to do with it. To be a voice of a generation means that you will become something like a mirror of the society. Artists known as the voices of generations just accentuated the problems of society they live in and frustration of people with current situation. Their music just reflects the atmosphere of their time, nothing more and nothing less.
Also Gagas gay rights activism has nothing to do with this. The fight for gay rights and equality has a long history, its not an issue which specifies this generation. And todays society is much more open minded and supportive of gay rights, so its not like to support LGBT movement is seen as something scandalous or provocative anymore, like it was 20 years ago. When you are supporting gay rights, you can become a gay icon (like many pop stars before), but it will not make you a voice of a generation.
So who do you think is more of a Voice for our Generation ? gaga or katy ?
4, Gaga stans argumented that she is the voice of our generation because of her massive charity work, because she uses her popularity for greater good... sorry, but this has nothing to do with it. To be a voice of a generation means that you will become something like a mirror of the society. Artists known as the voices of generations just accentuated the problems of society they live in and frustration of people with current situation. Their music just reflects the atmosphere of their time, nothing more and nothing less.
Also Gagas gay rights activism has nothing to do with this. The fight for gay rights and equality has a long history, its not an issue which specifies this generation. And todays society is much more open minded and supportive of gay rights, so its not like to support LGBT movement is seen as something scandalous or provocative anymore, like it was 20 years ago. When you are supporting gay rights, you can become a gay icon (like many pop stars before), but it will not make you a voice of a generation.
So, you'd say Gaga is something more that the voice of the generation, since she doesn't just accentuate one of the largest problems in modern society but also actively works against it?
Saying LGBT rights are irrelevant to this discussion is just silly. There are still people every day who kill themselves or are killed as a direct result of their sexuality. There are people who become depressed and feel as though their life is worthless. They are a part of our generation, and the problem is large enough that it needs to be recognized for what it is and treated as such, not belittled because most people are straight. It may not be "scandalous" or "provocative" anymore to support LGBT rights, but it sure is still a hell of a big deal to support it, especially as strongly as Gaga does.
Voices of generations always caused passionate reactions, were very outspoken, polarizing, provoking and pushed boundaries. Those artists were always going against the flow, what made them unique and outstanding.
And why is it that this part cannot be applied to Gaga, being that her music has arguably garnered more "passionate reactions, were very outspoken, polarizing, provoking and pushed boundaries" than ANY of her peers?
#1 in 18 countries
Top 5 in 5 more countries
14,000,000 downloads worldwide #2 song of the digital era worldwide
"Bad Romance"
#1 in 18 countries
Top 5 in 10 more countries
12,000,000 downloads worldwide
"Born This Way"
#1 in 23 countries
Top 5 in 8 more countries
8,600,000 downloads worldwide First #1 with "gay", "lesbian", "bi", and "transgender"
The Fame (Monster)
16,500,000 copies sold
7 top six US hits
Born This Way
8,000,000 copies sold (Gaga herself >>> Mediatraffic)
4 top 10 US hits
The Monster Ball Tour
$227.4 million gross
#15 tour of all time
The Born This Way Ball Tour
$70+ million after 43 dates
100% box office sell-out rate
Philanthropy & Activism:
$500k donated to Haiti
$1.5 million raised for Japan
$202 million raised from Gaga-endorsed Viva Glam to fight HIV/AIDS
$1.2 million from personal funds to start Born This Way Foundation
Performed and San Francisco Pride
Spoke at 2009 National Equality March
Spoke at For the 14k Rally
Called Senators about DADT and urged fans to do the same; many senators voicemail boxes were filled
So who do you think is more of a Voice for our Generation ? gaga or katy ?
Out of these two? Gaga, but I would not go as far as saying that she defines this generation.
Quote:
Originally posted by YSL
And why is it that this part cannot be applied to Gaga, being that her music has arguably garnered more "passionate reactions, were very outspoken, polarizing, provoking and pushed boundaries" than ANY of her peers?
Darling, I was talking about Katy there, read properly
Also Gaga is just going with the flow, she is not that challenging, she is playing a safe game, really...
Quote:
Originally posted by Retro Dance Freak
So, you'd say Gaga is something more that the voice of the generation, since she doesn't just accentuate one of the largest problems in modern society but also actively works against it?
Saying LGBT rights are irrelevant to this discussion is just silly. There are still people every day who kill themselves or are killed as a direct result of their sexuality. There are people who become depressed and feel as though their life is worthless. They are a part of our generation, and the problem is large enough that it needs to be recognized for what it is and treated as such, not belittled because most people are straight. It may not be "scandalous" or "provocative" anymore to support LGBT rights, but it sure is still a hell of a big deal to support it, especially as strongly as Gaga does.
I just said that it is not a problem only of this generation and that many other artists supported gay rights, but it made gay icons out of them, not voices of some generation!!!
And why is it that this part cannot be applied to Gaga, being that her music has arguably garnered more "passionate reactions, were very outspoken, polarizing, provoking and pushed boundaries" than ANY of her peers?
Gaga's music is not innovative. It's slightly different. And pretty damn catchy. When has her music made a consistent point regarding a highly controversial topic? The only reason why she stands out is because her peers are so mediocre.
Her visuals and videos are arguable though.
Quote:
Originally posted by Bríseis
Yes, this thread is a mess.
When someone says "voice of a generation", I immediatelly think of Nevermind and Never Mind The Bollocks - two albums that shook the ground, started some kind of movement and were seen as a statement of artists who thanks to them became voices of their generation and have huge, lasting impact on music and culture.
People who were arguing whether Katy or Gaga is the voice of our generation often have no idea what the "voice of a generation" actually is and used wrong arguments.
1, The voice of a generation is not defined by numbers and certainly not by money. It doesnt really matter who has won more awards, sold more records or whose tour grossed more. For example Elton John, Tom Jones or Celine Dion outsold almost all stars in the music industry, but are they known as "voice of a generation"? No. Why? Because their music is not challenging anything, nor changed anything.
2, The argument that "voice of our generation" must have a good voice is stupid. Artists like Kurt Cobain, Bob Dylan or Johnny Rotten are certainly not known for their vocal abilities, but their creativity, style and songwriting.
3, Katy Perry stans think she is the voice of our generation because her music is liked by broader range of people (including old people and little kids). The problem is that people like Katy because they dont have any problems with her. She and her generic pop music is not very controversial. Katy just goes with the flow and doesnt evoke strong feelings.
Voices of generations always caused passionate reactions, were very outspoken, polarizing, provoking and pushed boundaries. Those artists were always going against the flow, what made them unique and outstanding.
4, Gaga stans argumented that she is the voice of our generation because of her massive charity work, because she uses her popularity for greater good... sorry, but this has nothing to do with it. To be a voice of a generation means that you will become something like a mirror of the society. Artists known as the voices of generations just accentuated the problems of society they live in and frustration of people with current situation. Their music just reflects the atmosphere of their time, nothing more and nothing less.
Also Gagas gay rights activism has nothing to do with this. The fight for gay rights and equality has a long history, its not an issue which specifies this generation. And todays society is much more open minded and supportive of gay rights, so its not like to support LGBT movement is seen as something scandalous or provocative anymore, like it was 20 years ago. When you are supporting gay rights, you can become a gay icon (like many pop stars before), but it will not make you a voice of a generation.
I just said that it is not a problem only of this generation and that many other artists supported gay rights, but it made gay icons out of them, not voices of some generation!!!
But it's more of an issue now. Never before has the battle for LGBT rights and equality been as loud and active as it is now. Never before have we had a President announce support for gay marriage. Never before have we had so many states and countries attempting to legalize gay marriage. Never before has a pop musician gone to such lengths for the sake of LGBT equality.
Darling, 30 years ago, the situation was much worse than now, gays could have been arrested for kissing on the street... todays situation is like heaven to them in comparison Make yourself a favor and do some research before talking next time, k
Darling, this thread is about the voice of a generation, not about gay rights activism. Its complicated and situation in every country is different. I was talking about US in my post, to be more specific. Think what you want, gay rights activism doesnt make automatically a voice of a generation out of nobody. It makes you a Gay Icon. Thats different.
Darling, this thread is about the voice of a generation, not about gay rights activism. Its a really complicated problem and situation in every country is different. I was talking about the US in my post, to be more specific. Think what you want, gay rights activism doesnt make automatically a voice of a generation out of nobody. It makes you a Gay Icon. Thats different.
All you are doing is belittling the LGBT community and their problems by saying that someone who supports them can't be the voice of a generation. You are proving nothing by suggesting the issue isn't big enough to matter on the "voice of a generation" scale. Martin Luther King Jr. is considered the voice of a generation, a generation in which he stood up against inequality that was based on a defining factor that can not be controlled, despite the fact that the majority of people are not black. Now don't give me any crap about how comparing LGBT rights to racial rights is "absurd", or how comparing Gaga to MLK Jr. is "ludicrous" as some would - I want you to explain why LGBT rights aren't worthy of this level of problem when racial rights were.
Darling, I was talking about Katy there, read properly
Also Gaga is just going with the flow, she is not that challenging, she is playing a safe game, really...
I obviously know who you were talking about, that's why I asked you WHY it cannot be applied to Gaga since you mentioned that as the reason for Katy not being the voice. Read properly.
Quote:
Originally posted by highwayuni
Gaga's music is not innovative. It's slightly different. And pretty damn catchy. When has her music made a consistent point regarding a highly controversial topic? The only reason why she stands out is because her peers are so mediocre.
Did I say Gaga's music is innovative? Did I say it was groundbreaking like florals in the spring?
No. I asked a simple question and that was 'being that her music has arguably garnered more "passionate reactions, were very outspoken, polarizing, provoking and pushed boundaries" than ANY of her peers?'
If either of you could answer WHO of her PEERS is the voice of our generation, I would greatly appreciate it.
It's not Gaga's fault if her peers are "so mediocre" - if that's the case, that would still put Gaga above the rest by default so your point is invalid.
All you are doing is belittling the LGBT community and their problems by saying that someone who supports them can't be the voice of a generation. You are proving nothing by suggesting the issue isn't big enough to matter on the "voice of a generation" scale. Martin Luther King Jr. is considered the voice of a generation, a generation in which he stood up against inequality that was based on a defining factor that can not be controlled, despite the fact that the majority of people are not black. Now don't give me any crap about how comparing LGBT rights to racial rights is "absurd", or how comparing Gaga to MLK Jr. is "ludicrous" as some would - I want you to explain why LGBT rights aren't worthy of this level of problem when racial rights were.
Im not bellitling the LGBT community and their problems, I support gay rights. Look who is my avi, for **** sake. I said that supporting gay rights ALONE doesnt make you a voice of a generation, I never said that someone who supports gay rights cant be a voice of a generation, there is a difference. Kurt Cobain supported gay rights, but he became the voice of generation X for many reasons. Gloria Gaynor supported gay rights, but she never became a voice of some generation, but she is respected as a Gay Icon. End of discussion.
All you are doing is belittling the LGBT community and their problems by saying that someone who supports them can't be the voice of a generation. You are proving nothing by suggesting the issue isn't big enough to matter on the "voice of a generation" scale. Martin Luther King Jr. is considered the voice of a generation, a generation in which he stood up against inequality that was based on a defining factor that can not be controlled, despite the fact that the majority of people are not black. Now don't give me any crap about how comparing LGBT rights to racial rights is "absurd", or how comparing Gaga to MLK Jr. is "ludicrous" as some would - I want you to explain why LGBT rights aren't worthy of this level of problem when racial rights were.
Also, I think it's rather impossible to define who is "the voice of our generation" at the moment it's happening, it's more something that is gradually accepted as the years pass and you make it into the history books. I think a lot of the haters are in for a rude awakening 10 years from now when Gaga's impact in not only music, but culture is discussed.
#1 in 18 countries
Top 5 in 5 more countries
14,000,000 downloads worldwide #2 song of the digital era worldwide
"Bad Romance"
#1 in 18 countries
Top 5 in 10 more countries
12,000,000 downloads worldwide
"Born This Way"
#1 in 23 countries
Top 5 in 8 more countries
8,600,000 downloads worldwide First #1 with "gay", "lesbian", "bi", and "transgender"
The Fame (Monster)
16,500,000 copies sold
7 top six US hits
Born This Way
8,000,000 copies sold (Gaga herself >>> Mediatraffic)
4 top 10 US hits
The Monster Ball Tour
$227.4 million gross
#15 tour of all time
The Born This Way Ball Tour
$70+ million after 33 dates
100% box office sell-out rate
Philanthropy & Activism:
$500k donated to Haiti
$1.5 million raised for Japan
$202 million raised from Gaga-endorsed Viva Glam to fight HIV/AIDS
$1.2 million from personal funds to start Born This Way Foundation
Performed and San Francisco Pride
Spoke at 2009 National Equality March
Spoke at For the 14k Rally
Called Senators about DADT and urged fans to do the same; many senators voicemail boxes were filled
Impact? Yes, She Has It:
AND IN CONCLUSION:
I can tell you worked so hard on this post, and I really hate to break it to you, but... Katy's still the voice of our generation.
Im not bellitling the LGBT community and their problems, I support gay rights. Look who is my avi, for **** sake. I said that supporting gay rights ALONE doesnt make you a voice of a generation, I never said that someone who supports gay rights cant be a voice of a generation, there is a difference. Kurt Cobain supported gay rights, but he became the voice of generation X for many reasons. Gloria Gaynor supported gay rights, but she never became a voice of some generation, but she is respected as a Gay Icon. End of discussion.
No it is not the god damned end of the discussion because you have proven nothing. None of the people you named supported gay rights as strongly as Gaga and none supported it at as crucial a time. All MLK Jr. is remembered for by most people is his stance against inequality of the races, but that alone was enough to make him one of the most important historical figures in US history. Why the hell can't LGBT rights have the same position now as racial rights once held? I might not have to drink from a separate water fountain or be limited to specific areas to live in, but I am still being treated as subhuman by millions of people even in my own country. At the level that Gaga supports LGBT rights, it is foolish to simply list off people who, compared to her, only passively supported those rights and claim that she is automatically limited to the same status as them.
