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Stats: WW Biggest Girl Groups of 2015
Member Since: 6/22/2012
Posts: 26,585
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Quote:
Originally posted by shelven
Seems like these are pretty arbitrary rules, but whatever, I'll play by them. If we're counting total UK figures, then Worth It's total is 2,671,000 EXCLUDING certain countries where I couldn't find an accurate pure sales total in the 5H receipts thread (such as Canada and Italy). Reflection sold 155K in the US alone, so even though it probably didn't sell too much outside the US, it'd at least be enough to bring it close to 200K. So that puts 5H at a bare minimum of 2,871,000, which is higher than LM's 2,840,000 total.
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You do realise I was already generous enough to add Camila's duet onto 5H's sales, so I don't know why you're trying to act like I purposely deflated them.
And you wrote all of this because you wanted me to add 200k onto their sales, which has no bearing on their position in the ranking? 
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Member Since: 8/17/2012
Posts: 17,268
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Quote:
Originally posted by BlazingLovatic
You do realise I was already generous enough to add Camila's duet onto 5H's sales, so I don't know why you're trying to act like I purposely deflated them.
And you wrote all of this because you wanted me to add 200k onto their sales, which has no bearing on their position in the ranking? |
I'm not asking you to do anything. I was responding to MrLovett's post about LM "clearly outselling 5H if IKWYDLS is excluded" which was factually incorrect. You were the one who came in to defend his point, and I didn't think your explanation was logical either, so I responded. Don't act like I'm coming for you or asking you to change things when you're the one who entered this conversation, not me.
For the record, I don't think IKWYDLS should be part of 5H's total, but I do think that it should be acknowledged which group sold more without trying to introduce a bunch of random technicalities. Either no streaming should be included or all streaming should be included. Including only SOME streaming inaccurately skews the totals in favour of groups who do better in those specific countries.
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Member Since: 6/22/2012
Posts: 26,585
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Quote:
Originally posted by shelven
I'm not asking you to do anything. I was responding to MrLovett's post about LM "clearly outselling 5H if IKWYDLS is excluded" which was factually incorrect. You were the one who came in to defend his point, and I didn't think your explanation was logical either, so I responded. Don't act like I'm coming for you or asking you to change things when you're the one who entered this conversation, not me.
For the record, I don't think IKWYDLS should be part of 5H's total, but I do think that it should be acknowledged which group sold more without trying to introduce a bunch of random technicalities. Either no streaming should be included or all streaming should be included. Including only SOME streaming inaccurately skews the totals in favour of groups who do better in those specific countries.
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1. If you were responding to MrLovett, you should have quoted him, not me. That's usually how the quote feature functions.
2. I didn't agree with MrLovett's point that LM was above 5H, nor did I defend it. I corrected the sales in Ethereal's post & corrected your assumption that only LM benefitted from UK streams. (which was actually incorrect on my part, but that's besides the point - )
3. The only way to exclude all streaming is to not include any of LM's UK sales, and that's not happening, unless you want to find pure sales for each of their songs.
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Member Since: 8/17/2012
Posts: 17,268
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Quote:
Originally posted by BlazingLovatic
1. If you were responding to MrLovett, you should have quoted him, not me. That's usually how the quote feature functions.
2. I didn't agree with MrLovett's point that LM was above 5H, nor did I defend it. I corrected the sales in Ethereal's post & corrected your assumption that only LM benefitted from UK streams. (which was actually incorrect on my part, but that's besides the point - )
3. The only way to exclude all streaming is to not include any of LM's UK sales, and that's not happening, unless you want to find pure sales for each of their songs.
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My first post WAS quoting MrLovett  I then quoted you to refute your post that you had added to our conversation, which you now even admit was incorrect.
Like I said, pure sales figures are occasionally referenced in articles that the UK Official Charts website puts out, and they're almost always ~50% of the total. So cut LM's UK single sales in half like I cut Worth It's UK sales in half in the 5H receipts thread. Alternatively, you can choose to include US streams as well and acknowledge that streaming is an extremely popular method of consumption that should be factored into what makes an artist "big" (since the title of this thread IS "WW Biggest Girl Groups of 2015" after all). But only using some countries' streaming figures and not others makes absolutely no sense, regardless of the reason for it.
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Member Since: 6/22/2012
Posts: 26,585
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Quote:
Originally posted by shelven
My first post WAS quoting MrLovett I then quoted you to refute your post that you had added to our conversation, which you now even admit was incorrect.
Like I said, pure sales figures are occasionally referenced in articles that the UK Official Charts website puts out, and they're almost always ~50% of the total. So cut LM's UK single sales in half like I cut Worth It's UK sales in half in the 5H receipts thread. Alternatively, you can choose to include US streams as well and acknowledge that streaming is an extremely popular method of consumption that should be factored into what makes an artist "big" (since the title of this thread IS "WW Biggest Girl Groups of 2015" after all). But only using some countries' streaming figures and not others makes absolutely no sense, regardless of the reason for it. |
5H's streams may be 50% of their total, but a larger proportion of LM's are bought than streamed, because people buy Little Mix's music, so it's not really a case of only 50% of their total being sales.
As I said, find the pure sales of Black Magic & Love Me Like You Do, and I'll use those.
And you know, if I include US streams, then I'd also include the BILLIONS of streams from China - the world's largest country, where K-pop is v. popular, pushing 5H further down the chart.
tl;dr - Stop complaining about streams, unless you want 5H to be out of the top 10 lol.
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Member Since: 8/17/2012
Posts: 17,268
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Quote:
Originally posted by BlazingLovatic
5H's streams may be 50% of their total, but a larger proportion of LM's are bought than streamed, because people buy Little Mix's music, so it's not really a case of only 50% of their total being sales.
As I said, find the pure sales of Black Magic & Love Me Like You Do, and I'll use those.
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The 50% thing isn't exclusive to 5H. With very few exceptions, that's basically the industry standard now. Assuming that LM is an exception because people bought their album isn't a strong argument because artists that are very strong album sellers can also be very strong streamers (Beyonce and Drake are examples of this right now).
Using a 50% estimate would still be more accurate than using certain countries' streaming totals and not others'.
Quote:
And you know, if I include US streams, then I'd also include the BILLIONS of streams from China - the world's largest country, where K-pop is v. popular, pushing 5H further down the chart.
tl;dr - Stop complaining about streams, unless you want 5H to be out of the top 10 lol.
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My position that streaming should be included in measurements of popularity is not just exclusive to me stanning 5H, you know. I don't suggest it because it helps artists I stan - I suggest it because I genuinely do believe it's most representative of the current music industry. I'm curious to see receipts that these K-Pop groups are getting BILLIONS of streams from China, but if that is in fact true, I would still support you including them. I've already made it clear in numerous other threads that I don't like comparing Asian girl groups to Western girl groups since the markets are so vastly different, so I wouldn't care if the Top 10 is just a bunch of Asian groups as a result.
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Member Since: 8/28/2012
Posts: 34,863
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Quote:
Originally posted by BlazingLovatic
None of those groups released an album last year, and those numbers only include PHYSICAL albums anyway. Not digital ones, which I'm sure are very high considering they're digital monsters. |
Oh. I didn't know that.
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Member Since: 6/22/2012
Posts: 26,585
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Quote:
Originally posted by shelven
The 50% thing isn't exclusive to 5H. With very few exceptions, that's basically the industry standard now. Assuming that LM is an exception because people bought their album isn't a strong argument because artists that are very strong album sellers can also be very strong streamers (Beyonce and Drake are examples of this right now).
Using a 50% estimate would still be more accurate than using certain countries' streaming totals and not others'.
My position that streaming should be included in measurements of popularity is not just exclusive to me stanning 5H, you know. I don't suggest it because it helps artists I stan - I suggest it because I genuinely do believe it's most representative of the current music industry. I'm curious to see receipts that these K-Pop groups are getting BILLIONS of streams from China, but if that is in fact true, I would still support you including them. I've already made it clear in numerous other threads that I don't like comparing Asian girl groups to Western girl groups since the markets are so vastly different, so I wouldn't care if the Top 10 is just a bunch of Asian groups as a result.
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Aside from the fact that I don't read Chinese, and am not going to navigate multiple Chinese streaming sites to find streaming totals for every song these groups released last year, I really can't find any receipts on the English sites for Girl Groups anyway, since they don't really have as many hardcore fans to report these things, but here's a tabulation that a BigBang fan made, just to show you the scale of K-pop in China - 3.5 billion.
27 Billion views for Luhan
20.75 billion views for EXO
etc.
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Member Since: 5/27/2016
Posts: 387
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Threads like these only make stanwars and comparisons worse.
Why can't you all just listen to your fave group and admire them without dragging the others?
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Member Since: 6/22/2012
Posts: 26,585
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Bump, so thread doesn't expire
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Member Since: 5/27/2016
Posts: 4,150
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^ My pleasure. Even though we argue, I kinda love this thread.
Could you please add 7/27's sales on the OP? I forgot but I think that you're only using pure sales or SPS?
Here are the numbers so you don't have to look for them:
US Sales:
Pure: 70,603
SPS: 225k
Also could you add the sales of WFH and AIMH because I'm sure it's more than just that.
Thanks 
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Member Since: 6/22/2012
Posts: 26,585
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Quote:
Originally posted by All In My Head
^ My pleasure. Even though we argue, I kinda love this thread.
Could you please add 7/27's sales on the OP? I forgot but I think that you're only using pure sales or SPS?
Here are the numbers so you don't have to look for them:
US Sales:
Pure: 70,603
SPS: 225k
Also could you add the sales of WFH and AIMH because I'm sure it's more than just that.
Thanks |
Sorry, this thread is just for 2015.
I'll remake this thread in January, but for 2016 releases.
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Member Since: 6/3/2006
Posts: 51,724
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Those stats are not including 7/27 are they?
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Member Since: 6/3/2006
Posts: 51,724
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Quote:
Originally posted by All In My Head
^ My pleasure. Even though we argue, I kinda love this thread.
Could you please add 7/27's sales on the OP? I forgot but I think that you're only using pure sales or SPS?
Here are the numbers so you don't have to look for them:
US Sales:
Pure: 70,603
SPS: 225k
Also could you add the sales of WFH and AIMH because I'm sure it's more than just that.
Thanks |
I know!! With those stats, they will make a HUGE jump!
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Member Since: 6/22/2012
Posts: 26,585
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Quote:
Originally posted by Pedro
Those stats are not including 7/27 are they?
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No, it's 2015.
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Member Since: 5/27/2016
Posts: 4,150
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Quote:
Originally posted by BlazingLovatic
Sorry, this thread is just for 2015.
I'll remake this thread in January, but for 2016 releases. |
Ok cool! Can't wait for that. Thank you for making these threads.
But maybe we should do a thread that updates during the year?
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Member Since: 6/22/2012
Posts: 26,585
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Quote:
Originally posted by All In My Head
Ok cool! Can't wait for that. Thank you for making these threads.
But maybe we should do a thread that updates during the year?
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I thought about that, but it would be too hard to track when there's a new sales update or a group releases a new single/album, so it's easier & more accurate to just do it all at once.
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Member Since: 5/27/2016
Posts: 4,150
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Quote:
Originally posted by BlazingLovatic
I thought about that, but it would be too hard to track when there's a new sales update or a group releases a new single/album, so it's easier & more accurate to just do it all at once. |
Maybe update it once a month? That would be simpler.
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Member Since: 6/22/2012
Posts: 26,585
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Quote:
Originally posted by All In My Head
Maybe update it once a month? That would be simpler.
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I guess, but when I made this, I used year-end sales lists to find the sales.
There aren't really monthly sales lists, so I'd end up missing out half the releases, I'm sure.
For example, SNSD alone are releasing 7/8 mini albums this year.
If I didn't stan them, I probably wouldn't know about any ofthem
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Member Since: 5/27/2016
Posts: 4,150
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Quote:
Originally posted by BlazingLovatic
I guess, but when I made this, I used year-end sales lists to find the sales.
There aren't really monthly sales lists, so I'd end up missing out half the releases, I'm sure.
For example, SNSD alone are releasing 7/8 mini albums this year.
If I didn't stan them, I probably wouldn't know about any ofthem |
This is why they sale so many albums. 
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