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Discussion: U.S. Election 2016: Primary Season
ATRL Contributor
Member Since: 1/3/2014
Posts: 11,976
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Quote:
Originally posted by ezra
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This would be the equivalent of me posting about the KKK as if it were an accurate representation of white people. Please get over it.
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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Quote:
Originally posted by Skywalker
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None of that is related to vaccinations.
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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Quote:
Originally posted by Archetype
If you are a Bernie supporter and vote for the Green Party *just to spite Hillary*, you deserve Ben Carson as your president. Not even Trump, because he's too good for you.
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What about people who vote for the Green Party because their beliefs genuinely align with it more and want their vote and views to be accurately represented, even if the attempt is futile?
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Member Since: 3/3/2011
Posts: 4,231
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Quote:
Originally posted by Retro
What about people who vote for the Green Party because their beliefs genuinely align with it more and want their vote and views to be accurately represented, even if the attempt is futile?
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Big difference between that and voting Green "just to spite Hillary".
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Banned
Member Since: 8/31/2013
Posts: 20,327
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ramcoro
I am not making untrue statements. You said it right here:
You are asserting that high black unemployment rate is due to "bad parenting, education, and laziness". You are right on education, which I stated. You are deeply wrong on parenting and laziness.
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How could those things not be related, my friend? Low education and high drop out rates lead to smaller median incomes. Lower median incomes lead to lower quality of life and difficulty raising a family. This in turn breaks up families, dads peace out and leave women with children. We know for a FACT that single mothers are not optimal settings for child rearing and fathers/2 parent households are needed. This in turn effects young men in growing up without a father figure and can lead them into criminal activity and arrests. It's all connected and they are all apart of the problem. Here's the solution: 1) stay married 2) don't have kids until you can afford it 3) stay in school. We cannot just turn around and blame the holy ghost of "whiteness", worshiping at the altar of "intersectionality" while ignoring the real issues on the ground. Bernie/Hillary refuse to acknowledge the bit where all these people actually do have control over their lives and do need to make more responsible choices for themselves and their kids. Acknowledging the facts does not mean I am a racist or a troll or whatever other names I've been called in here (I don't care what you call me by the way I'm just pointing out that it's not an argument to call me a troll and walk away). /endrant
Quote:
Originally posted by Ramcoro
Can you answer me this? Why do you seem to think it is impossible the system is stacked against black people, but you are so confident that the system is hurting men?
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I have said that the criminal justice system inordinately seems stacked against men and black men in particular. Is it due to racism? Like, are cops purposefully going and arresting black men because they are black? Well, no but also kind of yes. It's due to a lot of things that involve high crime areas and the people living there wanting more police protection. More police will lead to more arrests and confrontations. These high crime areas tend to be poorer and less white. Refer to my paragraph above as to why this is not really racism.
Quote:
Originally posted by Ramcoro
You do know that vast majority of congress is male, so are most police officers and judges too. These statistics are improving, but they're still very male. So how can the system be stacked against men? Are these all just self hating men? You think voting for conservatives will help? Between 1980-2008 we had 20 years of conservative republicans and 8 years of our most conservative democratic, yet we still have this result. Obama didn't cause the disproportionate about of men in prison. I really do think it is about gender roles and stereotypes. |
Of course men make up those powerful positions. Men have a natural urge and desire to go for those positions. You might not like what I'm about to say but women just don't want to hold those jobs that's why they don't have them. Western countries are the most free places for women on Earth. No one is stopping a woman from running for any office, being a CEO, being in the military, running a business etc. except themselves. Women have the choice to do it or not in these Western countries and they usually choose not to. So, men (who want these jobs) take them. And at a steep price by the way.
Men make up 97% of combat fatalities. Men make up 82% of all work-related deaths http://www.bls.gov/iif/oshwc/cfoi/cfch0013.pdf Things like locomotive work, garbage men, electricians, police officers, ice road truckers lol, septic tank cleaners, construction of all kinds, heavy lifting and mechanical work etc. etc.. Men take these jobs because they want them. Women do not. Stop blaming men for the choices that women make. And stop trying to force women to do jobs they do not want to do.
Quote:
Originally posted by Ramcoro
BLM do want to be judge by the content of their character, but MLK and civil rights activist didn't get anywhere by saying "ALL LIVES MATTER". They made progress by pointing out the injustices black people face. They made progress by civil disobedience and their willingness to go to jail or worse for what they believed in.
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I've already addressed why I think this is bogus. BLM is extremely divisive and purely based on emotional rhetoric. They have no real positions based in fact it's all a blame game and white people are the ones they've scapegoated.
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Good talk! At the end of the day, most successful black people (especially rappers) know they love Donald Trump because he's a boss. He's the American dream and wants to teach the rest of the country how to get there rather than give them excuses for staying where they are (Bernie/Clinton). He's not trying to keep people on government services like the left is; rather, make them take back control of their lives. That's why I support him and that's why everyone should.
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Member Since: 8/29/2011
Posts: 18,282
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Quote:
Originally posted by Retro
What about people who vote for the Green Party because their beliefs genuinely align with it more and want their vote and views to be accurately represented, even if the attempt is futile?
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If someone legitimately wants to protest vote, then that's their right. However, if someone actually thinks Green Party can win, then they're badly mistaken.
I agree that the Dem Party needs to do more to attract the Green Party and keep them loyal.
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Banned
Member Since: 8/31/2013
Posts: 20,327
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Gosh. It is really hard being a Trump supporter on ATRL. I must do it, though. Someone has to.
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Banned
Member Since: 8/31/2013
Posts: 20,327
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Melania is so gorgeous. The new Jackie O.
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Member Since: 8/29/2011
Posts: 18,282
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Quote:
Originally posted by ezra
How could those things not be related, my friend? Low education and high drop out rates lead to smaller median incomes. Lower median incomes lead to lower quality of life and difficulty raising a family. This in turn breaks up families, dads peace out and leave women with children. We know for a FACT that single mothers are not optimal settings for child rearing and fathers/2 parent households are needed. This in turn effects young men in growing up without a father figure and can lead them into criminal activity and arrests. It's all connected and they are all apart of the problem. Here's the solution: 1) stay married 2) don't have kids until you can afford it 3) stay in school. We cannot just turn around and blame the holy ghost of "whiteness", worshiping at the altar of "intersectionality" while ignoring the real issues on the ground. Bernie/Hillary refuse to acknowledge the bit where all these people actually do have control over their lives and do need to make more responsible choices for themselves and their kids. Acknowledging the facts does not mean I am a racist or a troll or whatever other names I've been called in here (I don't care what you call me by the way I'm just pointing out that it's not an argument to call me a troll and walk away). /endrant
I have said that the criminal justice system inordinately seems stacked against men and black men in particular. Is it due to racism? Like, are cops purposefully going and arresting black men because they are black? Well, no but also kind of yes. It's due to a lot of things that involve high crime areas and the people living there wanting more police protection. More police will lead to more arrests and confrontations. These high crime areas tend to be poorer and less white. Refer to my paragraph above as to why this is not really racism.
Of course men make up those powerful positions. Men have a natural urge and desire to go for those positions. You might not like what I'm about to say but women just don't want to hold those jobs that's why they don't have them. Western countries are the most free places for women on Earth. No one is stopping a woman from running for any office, being a CEO, being in the military, running a business etc. except themselves. Women have the choice to do it or not in these Western countries and they usually choose not to. So, men (who want these jobs) take them. And at a steep price by the way.
Men make up 97% of combat fatalities. Men make up 82% of all work-related deaths http://www.bls.gov/iif/oshwc/cfoi/cfch0013.pdf Things like locomotive work, garbage men, electricians, police officers, ice road truckers lol, septic tank cleaners, construction of all kinds, heavy lifting and mechanical work etc. etc.. Men take these jobs because they want them. Women do not. Stop blaming men for the choices that women make. And stop trying to force women to do jobs they do not want to do.
I've already addressed why I think this is bogus. BLM is extremely divisive and purely based on emotional rhetoric. They have no real positions based in fact it's all a blame game and white people are the ones they've scapegoated.
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Good talk! At the end of the day, most successful black people (especially rappers) know they love Donald Trump because he's a boss. He's the American dream and wants to teach the rest of the country how to get there rather than give them excuses for staying where they are (Bernie/Clinton). He's not trying to keep people on government services like the left is; rather, make them take back control of their lives. That's why I support him and that's why everyone should. |
Lol no one is blaming the "Holy Ghost of whiteness". I am white. I never said you or any other white person is solely responsible.
This is what we mean by systemic racism. Want kids to stay in school? Make public school funding equal. Recruit talented teachers in all schools, not just the rich white suburbs. Want people to have kids after marriage? Help implement safe sex education, give out free condoms, make it raiser for teenage girls to get birth control, and keep funding planned parenthood. Want people to stay in marriages and not get divorce? Give them better economic opportunities and decrease economic inequality. Most research shows finacial/economic reasons is the #1 reason for divorce, if people give a reason.
You are touching on a lot of things that are true, but spinning it in a very untrue way.
You make a lot of assertions, but don't back any of them up with citations or facts.
Men are 97% of military fatalities because women have not been allowed to serve in combat roles. There is no draft. Everyone that is in the military has volunteered, and there are plenty of women that want to serve in combat roles. Why not let them if they want to? I don't want to "force" women to do anything. I don't want to "force" anyone to do anything. Also, if you want to talk abut military casualties, then I would argue that we should look at civilian casualties too.
Your assertion that women naturally seek lower work is not grounded in facts. Please, do some research. There are plenty of women that want to serve and participate, but are discouraged. Racism and sexism does not have to be explicit. It often comes in implicit ways, otherwise it would be easy to show a violation of the law. I truly think that most racists/sexists don't think they are racist or sexist. I can show you a video of a KKK member saying he's not racist. If it is just "women choosing not to be a leader" then why other countries have more equal rates of gender participation? Why do female doctors get paid less than male doctors? Why do female lawyers get paid less than male lawyers? Hint women didn't purposely volunteer for a lower salary.
"Most successful black people" as in like 3 random celebrities?
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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Quote:
Originally posted by Radiance
Big difference between that and voting Green "just to spite Hillary".
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I was merely asking if it would be acceptable.
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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Quote:
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Of course men make up those powerful positions. Men have a natural urge and desire to go for those positions. You might not like what I'm about to say but women just don't want to hold those jobs that's why they don't have them. Western countries are the most free places for women on Earth. No one is stopping a woman from running for any office, being a CEO, being in the military, running a business etc. except themselves. Women have the choice to do it or not in these Western countries and they usually choose not to. So, men (who want these jobs) take them. And at a steep price by the way.
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Banned
Member Since: 8/31/2013
Posts: 20,327
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ramcoro
Lol no one is blaming the "Holy Ghost of whiteness". I am white. I never said you or any other white person is solely responsible.
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You're still holding on to it. "Solely". As if I'm even partly responsible for other peoples lives because I was born white. 
Quote:
Originally posted by Ramcoro
This is what we mean by systemic racism. (1)Want kids to stay in school? Make public school funding equal. Recruit talented teachers in all schools, not just the rich white suburbs. (2)Want people to have kids after marriage? Help implement safe sex education, give out free condoms, make it raiser for teenage girls to get birth control, and keep funding planned parenthood. Want people to stay in marriages and not get divorce? Give them better economic opportunities and decrease economic inequality. Most research shows finacial/economic reasons is the #1 reason for divorce, if people give a reason.
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(1). I agree. Schools should be funded justly (not equally) by state not by local communities alone. It leaves children in positions where their community is poor and their educational opportunities are stymied. You think Hillary Clinton is going to do jack about the educational funding system? Come on, now.. There's still problems with this anyway. I went to a really wealthy school where I live. Does "equality" mean we need to lower funding for schools that have a lot and give it to areas that don't? That seems unjust to those wealthy areas that worked for what they have (I know my family did!). Sounds like Marxism, actually. I think areas should still fund their schools locally but there needs to be an "at minimum" amount per area that the state makes up for if the local community can't on their own. That would be the wealthy and middle class subsidizing poorer areas. Probably a good idea to stop demonizing these people, right? And about recruiting teachers for poor schools. LOL. Do you have any plan how you would go about that (Hillary sure doesn't!)? I know for a fact that teachers here in Michigan would only go to Detroit to teach if at gunpoint (awful pay, huge student load, usually far drive, no benefits). Are we going to coerce these teachers into doing jobs they don't want somehow? This plan kind of stinks. 
(2). Free stuff? You think condoms (which have been available for decades and you can buy in most bathrooms for a quarter) are going to solve this issue? This is just dodging responsibility. I agree Planned Parenthood should be funded. That's been around for decades as well and welp, here we are. Problems as big as ever. Birth control for young girls has all kinds of drawbacks by the way. It's a huge deal to take that and can really screw with your body. Just to keep in mind.
Quote:
Originally posted by Ramcoro
You are touching on a lot of things that are true, but spinning it in a very untrue way.
You make a lot of assertions, but don't back any of them up with citations or facts.
Men are 97% of military fatalities because women have not been allowed to serve in combat roles. There is no draft (yes there is; all American males must sign up for it at 18; women do not). Everyone that is in the military has volunteered, and there are plenty of women that want to serve in combat roles. Why not let them if they want to? I don't want to "force" women to do anything. I don't want to "force" anyone to do anything. Also, if you want to talk abut military casualties, then I would argue that we should look at civilian casualties too.
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This is an entire other argument that has to do with biology and sexual dimorphic traits. I do not think women should be on the front lines unless able to meet the minimum requirements (so, it's never going to be 50/50 like you and other feminists want). Congress is actually moving to make the draft a thing women do  It's spear-headed by liberals at the moment.
Quote:
Originally posted by Ramcoro
Your assertion that women naturally seek lower work is not grounded in facts. (Yes, it is. Women are not made happy by seeking high stress jobs. They prefer raising families and their relationships.) Please, do some research. There are plenty of women that want to serve and participate, but are discouraged. Racism and sexism does not have to be explicit. (?) It often comes in implicit ways, otherwise it would be easy to show a violation of the law. I truly think that most racists/sexists don't think they are racist or sexist. (Ah, so like, it's invisible and undetectable unless you're 'woke'. Maybe it's more likely that something that's invisible, undetectable and unmeasurable is just not real?) I can show you a video of a KKK member saying he's not racist. If it is just "women choosing not to be a leader" then why other countries have more equal rates of gender participation? (They don't. Men are in power everywhere more than women) Why do female doctors get paid less than male doctors? (citation needed)Why do female lawyers get paid less than male lawyers? (citation needed)Hint women didn't purposely volunteer for a lower salary. (No, they choose family life more often and it effects the aggregate scores of the wages in comparison to men; who, by the way, measure their own happiness based on their salary and jobs so of course they go after working with more vigor) |
Sigh. I have a lot of work to do in here. Voting Hillary will continue all these problems (especially the ones against black men; Mrs. "Super Predators" is a feminist and we know who feminists categorize men and how they want the law to be even more strict and ruthless with them).
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Member Since: 5/12/2012
Posts: 7,989
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Quote:
Originally posted by ezra
Melania is so gorgeous. The new Jackie O. |
I actually think Melania is odd looking... Something just looks off about her... I actually think Heidi Cruz is pretty attractive.
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Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 21,143
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I typed up a paragraph response to this mess, but then I decided to make a margarita instead. Go forth in Christ.
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Member Since: 8/7/2015
Posts: 3,830
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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Quote:
Originally posted by Citrus
I typed up a paragraph response to this mess, but then I decided to make a margarita instead. Go forth in Christ.
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Sometimes all you can do is stare in awe.
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Banned
Member Since: 8/31/2013
Posts: 20,327
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I'm glad the facts are awe-some 
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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What facts? You haven't provided any.
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Banned
Member Since: 8/31/2013
Posts: 20,327
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Quote:
Originally posted by Retro
What facts? You haven't provided any.
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Ignoring the dozen or so studies on the last pages isn't going to make smearing me any more effective.
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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You haven't linked to a single scientifically validated study that discussed any of the claims you have been making. If you had, your own links would have shown your analysis to be incredibly surface-level and flawed. Come back when you actually have citations!
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Kill Whitey