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ATRL: Is Gay Marriage A Human Right?
Banned
Member Since: 6/25/2011
Posts: 37,192
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Quote:
Originally posted by JeremyALD
What the **** has race got to do with anything?The two are not comparable, unless of course being gay isn't a choice, which was a simple question I asked. And no I don't seek to please others - what I'm I doing now. I'm virtually against the entire forum.
No your not supposed to role over. But when a celebrity endorses someone, you don't need to call at them out with all this hate. We live in a politically correct world and I'm not sure if that's a good thing. I think primarily we should live our lives. If you want to get married, fine. Express your viewpoint. But if people were just sometimes, I don't think there would be as much negative undertone to homosexuality.
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LET ME MAKE THIS SIMPLE FOR YOU.
Fact: NO ONE KNOWS whether being gay is a choice or not. Most scientific and psychological evidence points to it NOT being a choice, but it is hard, if not IMPOSSIBLE to prove something as abstract as sexuality.
So we have two options now:
Option 1: Being gay isn't a choice, so it's a human right for them to get married, according to your logic.
Option 2: Being gay IS a choice, so they are CHOOSING to marry someone of the same gender. You say this makes it NOT a human right. HOWEVER, this calls to mind the issue of interracial marriage, where it is EXPRESSLY a choice to marry someone of a different race. The Supreme Court has ruled that is is a HUMAN RIGHT to be able to get married in the case of interracial marriage, which is most definitely a choice.
Clearly, either way, it doesn't matter and gay marriage is a human right, whether it is a choice or not.
P.S. "If you want to get married, fine."
Except it's not fine, because there are people ACTIVELY TRYING TO PREVENT GAYS FROM GETTING MARRIED.
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Member Since: 12/7/2011
Posts: 21,578
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Quote:
Originally posted by JeremyALD
What the **** has race got to do with anything? The two are not comparable, unless of course being gay isn't a choice, which was a simple question I asked. And no I don't seek to please others - what am I doing now. I'm virtually against the entire forum.
No your not supposed to role over. But when a celebrity endorses someone, you don't need to call at them out with all this hate. We live in a politically correct world and I'm not sure if that's a good thing. I think primarily we should live our lives. If you want to get married, fine. Express your viewpoint. But if people were just themselves, I don't think there would be as much negative undertone to homosexuality.
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Are u saying that gay people are not themselves and they are fake 
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Member Since: 7/13/2010
Posts: 11,566
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Quote:
Originally posted by JeremyALD
What the **** has race got to do with anything? The two are not comparable, unless of course being gay isn't a choice, which was a simple question I asked. And no I don't seek to please others - what am I doing now. I'm virtually against the entire forum.
No your not supposed to role over. But when a celebrity endorses someone, you don't need to call at them out with all this hate. We live in a politically correct world and I'm not sure if that's a good thing. I think primarily we should live our lives. If you want to get married, fine. Express your viewpoint. But if people were just themselves, I don't think there would be as much negative undertone to homosexuality.
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I think you dont understand the meaning of "be yourself". If people want to be drag queens, transvestites, feminine,etc., then that is them being themselves.
By the sounds of it Id rather be surrounded by a crowd of drag queens lip synching for their life to a Britney track then have a pseudo-intelletual conversation with you.
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Member Since: 3/15/2011
Posts: 2,676
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Quote:
Originally posted by IfICannot Love♥
And what's this random **** about the gay being a choice/not a choice argument? That doesn't matter, at all. Even if someone chooses to be gay, they still have a right to marry whoever they want.
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And this is your opinion and that is how it remain. People are entitled to their opinions. But we are slowly moving towards a world where people won't be entitled to expressing them under a left wing approach 
Do you believe people should mold to other people's expectations, or make choices on what they believe is right?
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Member Since: 9/18/2011
Posts: 30,431
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Quote:
Originally posted by ****y On Venus
I'm just tired of debating this. And the fact that people will still question someone else's personal rights in 2011 is really disheartening.
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All of this. It's 2011 and some people are still close minded about personal rights 
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Member Since: 11/22/2011
Posts: 1,244
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In the case Loving v. Virginia, in a unanimous decision the Supreme Court ruled that:
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Originally posted by Supreme Court
Marriage is one of the basic civil rights of man
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So yes, it is considered a human right, at least in the United States. But, moreover, even if it wasn't, so what? Does assigning it a label such as "privilege" make it any less discriminatory that gays cannot marry? Homosexuals in this country, and around the world, are treated as second-class citizens, primarily through their inability to reap legal benefits of marriage, which is in direct contradiction to the fourteenth amendment:
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Originally posted by The Fourteenth Amendment of the United States Constitution
Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws
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and also through it being legal, in most states, to fire a person for their sexuality with no legal repercussions.
So yes, it is an equality issue, and to say otherwise is ridiculous. And furthermore, it is not blown out of proportion, because when an entire segment of the population is discriminated against because of the way they were born*, nothing is more important than fighting for civil liberties. How can we call ourselves a free country when anywhere from 3%-10% of our country is systematically repressed by their own freaking government?
So, to answer your question in short: it is not blown out of proportion, and it is an equality issue. And it is incredibly important.
*And in regards to your "is there any evidence that gay is not a choice": ignoring the dangerous and inane implications of that statement, even if the answer is "no," does it matter? Why should it matter who we love? It's not up for anyone to decide who we can love and who we can't.
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Originally posted by JeremyALD
I seriously think gay marriage is an issue where you have to consider your upbringing, others and yourself. It's a conscious vote and I think it should stay that way.
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Of course the environmental factors of homophobia aren't to be ignored, but that is still no excuse for deliberately abridging the rights of innocent citizens. It is irrelevant to the overall issue, because one side is abridging the rights of others, and the other isn't.
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Originally posted by JeremyALD
Do all artists really need to waive their flags in support of gay rights? Are we not just normal people? Why do we have to define ourselves so separately sometimes?
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Here I agree with you; the entire controversy of Clarkson liking Ron Paul is exceedingly silly.
This thread wreaks of Stockholm Syndrome.
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Member Since: 8/22/2009
Posts: 50,646
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Quote:
Originally posted by JeremyALD
Is there actually any conclusive evidence that being gay is not a choice?
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Is there actually any conclusive evidence that being straight is not a choice?
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Member Since: 3/15/2011
Posts: 2,676
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Quote:
Originally posted by L/\DY G/\G/\
I think you dont understand the meaning of "be yourself". If people want to be drag queens, transvestites, feminine,etc., then that is them being themselves.
By the sounds of it Id rather be surrounded by a crowd of drag queens lip synching for their life to a Britney track then have a pseudo-intelletual conversation with you.
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I believe transgender is a choice, so I'm not going to judge people for thinking homosexuality is too.
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Banned
Member Since: 6/25/2011
Posts: 37,192
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Quote:
Originally posted by Entalan
FATALITY
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DAMN BITCH! Where did YOU come from? Pull up a seat and stay a while! 
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Member Since: 12/1/2010
Posts: 23,572
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Jerm, did you have an experience with a bisexual man? Did he leave you for a woman? What do you think help to mold your variety of conflicting viewpoints throughout this thread?
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Member Since: 6/17/2011
Posts: 16,910
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Quote:
Originally posted by JeremyALD
I believe transgender is a choice, so I'm not going to judge people for thinking homosexuality is too.
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You see that sign out button on the top right.... 
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ATRL Contributor
Member Since: 5/28/2011
Posts: 39,615
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Quote:
Originally posted by JeremyALD
And this is your opinion and that is how it remain. People are entitled to their opinions. But we are slowly moving towards a world where people won't be entitled to expressing them under a left wing approach
Do you believe people should mold to other people's expectations, or make choices on what they believe is right? |
I believe, ahem, that homosexuality is not a choice, and I believe that anyone, not just homosexuals, or just heterosexuals, EVERYONE, should be able to do what they want: Get married, not get married, etc. I honestly think that people should just do whatever feels best for them, and not give a **** about what anyone else thinks.
Is that okay with you, or do you think that people should do otherwise?
Quote:
Originally posted by JeremyALD
I believe transgender is a choice, so I'm not going to judge people for thinking homosexuality is too.
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Didn't you say you felt you were a female rather than a gay male in that one thread you got clocked to Hell in back in, like August? 
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Member Since: 3/15/2011
Posts: 2,676
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Quote:
Originally posted by SLAYANNA NAVY
Are u saying that gay people are not themselves and they are fake |
No I'm saying people change to fit the mold of the displayed society. I see it time and time again. My friends change to fit the expectations of the gay lifestyle. When before they were just the average person who were attracted to males.
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Banned
Member Since: 6/25/2011
Posts: 37,192
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Quote:
Originally posted by JeremyALD
I believe transgender is a choice, so I'm not going to judge people for thinking homosexuality is too.
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Why does whether or not being gay is a choice MATTER though? Don't we live in a country where we let people CHOOSE who they want to marry? 
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Member Since: 12/7/2011
Posts: 21,578
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Quote:
Originally posted by Amaru
You see that sign out button on the top right.... |
SHOW HIM THE WAY SIS!!
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Member Since: 3/12/2011
Posts: 10,342
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jameson Teqkilla
DAMN BITCH! Where did YOU come from? Pull up a seat and stay a while! |
I like the post edit, Etalans to be specific "fatality" 
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Member Since: 3/15/2011
Posts: 2,676
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Quote:
Originally posted by Vertigo Stick
Jerm, did you have an experience with a bisexual man? Did he leave you for a woman? What do you think help to mold your variety of conflicting viewpoints throughout this thread?
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Again please quote me, besides bringing other "rights" into this thread, I don't believe I have contradicted myself on my basic viewpoints. And if I have I have furthered my opinion in following posts.
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Banned
Member Since: 6/25/2011
Posts: 37,192
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Quote:
Originally posted by JeremyALD
No I'm saying people change to fit the mold of the displayed society. I see it time and time again. My friends change to fit the expectations of the gay lifestyle. When before they were just the average person who were attracted to males.
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What if that's who they always wanted to be, and they felt forced to be the "average person who was attracted to males" by the heteronormative pressures of society?
Why are you only for gay men being themselves if that means behaving like a "normal" man?
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Member Since: 7/13/2010
Posts: 11,566
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Quote:
Originally posted by JeremyALD
No I'm saying people change to fit the mold of the displayed society. I see it time and time again. My friends change to fit the expectations of the gay lifestyle. When before they were just the average person who were attracted to males.
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The expectation of the gay lifestyle most places is to stay in the closet and "become" straight.
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Member Since: 11/4/2006
Posts: 37,808
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The problem is religion. People get on their ridiculous religious high horses and feel like they get to dictate how they should live. It's ironic, considering the Bible tells people not to judge. I don't understand why people care so much of homosexuals getting married. It doesn't harm anyone, and it doesn't effect anyone but those who are homosexual.
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