Discussion: Paleo, Keto, High-fat Low Carb Thread - Page 3

ABEL-o-matic

Quote:

Originally posted by BGXKB

Let me provide just a few of the many scientific studies (since I like to actually use science and not make baseless claims based on an agenda

)
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17583796
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17522610
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19604407
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19209185
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23414424
http://m.ajcn.nutrition.org/content/...13613.abstract

Just for the heck of it, since our vegan friends above insist that their diet is obviously superior without a shred of actual science (or even logic), I'll throw in an article with numerous sources and citations which explain the half-baked arguments that vegans make in defense of a half-baked diet.
https://authoritynutrition.com/top-1...t-vegan-diets/

And a meta-analysis of vegan diets
http://m.ajcn.nutrition.org/content/89/5/1627S.full

As you can see, paleo diets have all of the benefits without any of the drawbacks. Research into paleo diets is still relatively new, but it isn't like we weren't all eating paleo just 10,000 years ago before eating grains were ever even a thing.

Additional reading:
Research how vegans have pushed numerous erroneous claims over the years which have both shaped government nutritional guidelines (many of which have now been either redacted or found to be unsubstantiated) and pressured corporations to do such hopelessly silly things as replace animal fats with transitive fats.

But ask any single one of them and they will all say, in unison, how superior it is no matter what actual science you confront them with.

Yas, not you using NCBI too. I only research NCBI publishings whenever I am in doubt of any health related things.

The only thing I'm concerned is that my family has a history of a NAFL, so is Paleo/Keto safe for me? And will it even reverse my NAFL?

BGXKB

Quote:

Originally posted by ABEL-o-matic

Yas, not you using NCBI too. I only research NCBI publishings whenever I am in doubt of any health related things.

The only thing I'm concerned is that my family has a history of a NAFL, so is Paleo/Keto safe for me? And will it even reverse my NAFL?

Absolutely! I believe it's the first or second study I cited that mentions how even if you do not lose weight of paleo (the study did not measure weight loss) then you will almost assuredly see a huge decrease of accumulated fat in your liver. Non-alcoholic fatty liver disease has been consistently linked to a high consumption of carbohydrates and the paleo diet is the opposite of that.

I hope this was helpful!

BGXKB

Quote:

Originally posted by jxck

I'm not sure where such a strong aversion to veganism comes from - I remind you that, as Suede said, we come in peace and aren't here to hurt you or anything.

I think you raised a great idea, and I'm right there with you - let's look at science! As you stated, you don't like baseless claims.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19562864

http://jaoa.org/article.aspx?articleid=2517494

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22230619

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27253526

http://www.pnas.org/content/113/15/4146.abstract

http://journals.plos.org/plosmedicin...l.pmed.1002039

I think a return to whole foods is absolutely wonderful - and the attention that the Paleo diet is bringing to that is great. It's of no surprise to me that it renders favourable results in studies. Naturally, as you'd know, I just don't support the consumption of animal products within that, and I attribute much of it's success to the consumption of plant foods within it.

I'm just not sure why any of this is worth arguing about, I entered this thread respectfully as I could, gave some ideas to soothe inflammatory debate and wished you the best. I'm especially confused about this debate considering that a lot of the evidence you've supplied actually confirms my position. Let's take a look.

The meta analysis you supplied concluded with;

This doesn't stand at odds with anything I'm saying.

Let's take a look at the differences of the studies supplied. Again, I'm not here to call you stupid or suggest anything of the sort. I just want to examine the evidence we have.

Studies you mentioned at the start of your post in support of a paleo diet;
#1. Reviewed 29 people over 12 weeks.
#2. Reviewed 14 people over 3 weeks. Concluded with "showed some favourable effects by the diet, but further studies, including control group, are needed."
#3. Reviewed 13 people over 3 months.
#4. Reviewed 9 people over 20 days.
#5. Reviewed 10 people over 5 weeks.
#6.Reviewed 159 people, the timespan unclear due to the full text being unavailable to the public.

Studies I've supplied;
#1. Only an abstract was listed.
#2. Reviewed 3,351,502 participants over 28 years.
#3. Directly reviewed 500 subjects, compared to a previous study involving 90,000 people over a 5 year period.
#4. Reviewed 93 participants over 12 weeks.
#5. Reviewed 50 published studies, the first in 2004 (overall timespan unclear).
#6. Reviewed 200,727 participants over a 32 year period.

Given the difference in magnitude of the evidence we've both put forward, I'm not quite sure why, when I enter a thread with a polite recommendation, word of support and expressed will to put an end to arguments, I'm met with the remark that "our vegan friends above insist that their diet is obviously superior without a shred of actual science (or even logic)".

I want you to know that I'm here to listen to you. I'm interested to hear the evidence you put forth, and what your opinion is. I love hearing of these things. My ongoing discussion with you doesn't come about because I slam the keyboard to reply 2 minutes after your posts to say "**** you!!!!

". Could you point me in the direction of the additional reading you suggested? "The research on how vegans have pushed numerous erroneous claims over the years which have both shaped government nutritional guidelines?" I want to have a read. Not to go through with a highlighter finding flaws - but to truly find what's out there. Thank you for bringing that up - please drop by my wall, or here, or whatever you like with them.

Thank you for your time. To anybody else using this thread, please continue!

Congratulations! You have provided substantial evidence for a claim that is not even the topic of this discussion nor even this thread.

We were never debating if a vegan diet is superior to the standard Western diet. That's a no-brainer. Please remain on topic. I know it may be difficult for you.

ABEL-o-matic

Nnnm. Cavemen got the Vegans shook.

ABEL-o-matic

Quote:

Originally posted by BGXKB

Absolutely! I believe it's the first or second study I cited that mentions how even if you do not lose weight of paleo (the study did not measure weight loss) then you will almost assuredly see a huge decrease of accumulated fat in your liver. Non-alcoholic fatty liver disease has been consistently linked to a high consumption of carbohydrates and the paleo diet is the opposite of that.

I hope this was helpful!

Oh wow! I eat A LOT of rice. This may be it.

BGXKB

Quote:

Originally posted by ABEL-o-matic

Oh wow! I eat A LOT of rice. This may be it.

Personally, I have found that brown rice and whole oats along with "ancient" grains are ok in small quantities. I don't know what your budget is like, but there are rice substitutes which are paleo friendly. My personal favorite is to boiling cauliflower in no sodium chicken broth until all of the liquid is gone and then mash it until it has a similar consistency to cheesy rice or a casserole. I know that there are also shirtitaki/konjac based rice substitutes.

2NE1

Is this called the caveman diet and aren't you suppose to have a lot of carbs? You can die from too little carbs, right?

Komet blu

I've been on keto/lowcarb for the 2nd half of 2015 since I wanted to lose weight. not only did it work AF, I felt so much better overall.
Now that my exams and all the stress that goes with them are DUN, I think I'm going back, not to keto, but to some low carb/paleo mix diet. esp seeing as summer is coming.

BGXKB

Quote:

Originally posted by 2NE1

Is this called the caveman diet and aren't you suppose to have a lot of carbs? You can die from too little carbs, right?

I thought this too until my junior year in Biology. Carbohydrates are the only macronutrients that we can consume 0 grams of. Fats and proteins are the only two essential macronutrients.

TinkerbellClap

Bumping this.

TinkerbellClap

Quote:

Originally posted by 2NE1

Is this called the caveman diet and aren't you suppose to have a lot of carbs? You can die from too little carbs, right?

Food pyramid has been wrong for decades. With these diets, instead of eating carbs and your body burning these carbs to use as energy, you eat fat (not trans fat, good fat like butter and olive oil/olives etc). When your body realizes that there's no sufficient carbs in your body to burn, it starts burning your fat for energy = ketosis!