|
Poll: Hillary Clinton v Bernie Sanders?
View Poll Results: Hillary or Bernie?
|
Hillary Clinton
|
  
|
15 |
34.88% |
Bernie Sanders
|
  
|
26 |
60.47% |
Other
|
  
|
2 |
4.65% |
Member Since: 8/7/2015
Posts: 3,063
|
Hillary Clinton v Bernie Sanders?
Who would you rather have as the President of the United States?
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/7/2015
Posts: 6,317
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 8,579
|
Honestly, neither. Hilary is a corrupt, manipulative liar you can't trust. Bernie Sanders isn't, and i respect his right to a differing opinion than mine, but I believe that history has shown socialism to be an ineffective economic method time and time again. It doesn't improve people's state of living, it just wipes out the middle class (and, hell, a good portion of the upper class), moves them to the lower class, and leaves the government officials and the rest of the .1% with all of the country's money + zero class mobility for lower classes
|
|
|
Member Since: 3/15/2013
Posts: 25,228
|
Bernie, by miles and miles.
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/7/2015
Posts: 3,063
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Repo
Honestly, neither. Hilary is a corrupt, manipulative liar you can't trust. Bernie Sanders isn't, and i respect his right to a differing opinion than mine, but I believe that history has shown socialism to be an ineffective economic method time and time again. It doesn't improve people's state of living, it just wipes out the middle class (and, hell, a good portion of the upper class), moves them to the lower class, and leaves the government officials and the rest of the .1% with all of the country's money + zero class mobility for lower classes
|
Who would you like to see in office?
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 8,579
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Atlas
Who would you like to see in office?
|
Honestly, I'm not sure. I can't see I've seen any candidate who stands out to me as someone I'm particularly hoping wins. I'm waiting until we get closer to the election so I can see more from the main two candidates before I really make that call.
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/18/2013
Posts: 20,070
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/7/2015
Posts: 23,857
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Repo
Honestly, neither. Hilary is a corrupt, manipulative liar you can't trust. Bernie Sanders isn't, and i respect his right to a differing opinion than mine, but I believe that history has shown socialism to be an ineffective economic method time and time again. It doesn't improve people's state of living, it just wipes out the middle class (and, hell, a good portion of the upper class), moves them to the lower class, and leaves the government officials and the rest of the .1% with all of the country's money + zero class mobility for lower classes
|
The problem with this is that Bernie isn't exactly a full socialist. Plus he would still need to get through the rest of the government.
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 8,579
|
Quote:
Originally posted by dessy
The problem with this is that Bernie isn't exactly a full socialist. Plus he would still need to get through the rest of the government.
|
The rest of government is why I'd probably why I'd lean towards him over Hilary (he doesn't seem corrupt, at the very least, and I don't see all the U.S. switching to pure socialism)
Out of curiosity, could you explain some of the major differences between Bernie's policies/full socialism? I do believe you, I'm just curious to have a clearer image of what he believes and stands for
|
|
|
ATRL Contributor
Member Since: 2/5/2014
Posts: 1,808
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Repo
Honestly, neither. Hilary is a corrupt, manipulative liar you can't trust. Bernie Sanders isn't, and i respect his right to a differing opinion than mine, but I believe that history has shown socialism to be an ineffective economic method time and time again. It doesn't improve people's state of living, it just wipes out the middle class (and, hell, a good portion of the upper class), moves them to the lower class, and leaves the government officials and the rest of the .1% with all of the country's money + zero class mobility for lower classes
|
He's not a socialist. He's a democratic socialist. There's a profound difference between the two.
History has shown nothing about socialism. The Soviet Union wasn't even socialist. Heck The Soviet Union wasn't even really Marx's vision of communism - more like a dictatorship masquerading as a communism.
Scandinavian countries like Norway and Sweden have proven that democratic socialism can be a viable system. It remains to be seen whether those policies can work on a larger scale in a country such as the US however it's never been attempted before so it's too quick to dismiss it outright. Additionally Bernie has decades of policy making on his side - I'm sure he's thought long and hard about how to translate these policies from nations of 8-10 million sized populations to the US's population of 300 million.
|
|
|
ATRL Contributor
Member Since: 2/5/2014
Posts: 1,808
|
All of Bernie's main talking points are about addressing the income disparity between the incredibly wealthy 0.1% and re-establishing a middle class. Specifically tackling the insanely wealthy investment bankers and Wall Street business men who are moving their wealth outside of the country to avoid being taxed by the government.
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/7/2015
Posts: 23,857
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Repo
The rest of government is why I'd probably why I'd lean towards him over Hilary (he doesn't seem corrupt, at the very least, and I don't see all the U.S. switching to pure socialism)
Out of curiosity, could you explain some of the major differences between Bernie's policies/full socialism? I do believe you, I'm just curious to have a clearer image of what he believes and stands for
|
This person explains why I disagree with your post.
Quote:
Originally posted by Team_Avatar
He's not a socialist. He's a democratic socialist. There's a profound difference between the two.
History has shown nothing about socialism. The Soviet Union wasn't even socialist. Heck The Soviet Union wasn't even really Marx's vision of communism - more like a dictatorship masquerading as a communism.
Scandinavian countries like Norway and Sweden have proven that democratic socialism can be a viable system. It remains to be seen whether those policies can work on a larger scale in a country such as the US however it's never been attempted before so it's too quick to dismiss it outright. Additionally Bernie has decades of policy making on his side - I'm sure he's thought long and hard about how to translate these policies from nations of 8-10 million sized populations to the US's population of 300 million.
|
To go further, democratic socialism takes to the votes. So essentially the government doesn't have full control over economical issues as the people are still the deciding factors for various issues especially the economy as oppose to socalism giving the government full central control. Many nations actually support Democratic socialism especially in Northern Europe and Latin America.
There are also many various democratic socalism concepts like Canada's health care system and France's childcare thing. Imagine this extended success on a nationwide scale.
Unfortunately conservatives will attempt to misinform the public by pointing out what you described (the failure of "socialism") and people will actually fall for it like sheep.
|
|
|
Banned
Member Since: 4/27/2012
Posts: 33,811
|
As someone who hasn't fallen for media propaganda and doesn't live in a fantasy land, Hillary Rodham Clinton
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 8,579
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Giselle
As someone who hasn't fallen for media propaganda and doesn't live in a fantasy land, Hillary Rodham Clinton
|
The definition of irony
----
RE: Bernie Sanders
Really valid and informative points. Thank you for the more detailed explanations. I still can't say I'm totally sold on him (seeing as I just had some of his policies clarified today), but clearly I didn't have all my facts straight and will need to look up more about him and his policies in specific before making a final judgment on my opinions towards him. That said, if nothing else, I always respected the fact that he took a stance and stood by it rather than lie and play each side.
|
|
|
Member Since: 6/6/2011
Posts: 3,476
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/29/2011
Posts: 3,420
|
Hilary is a wretch. Feel the Bern!
|
|
|
Member Since: 5/3/2012
Posts: 42,099
|
Bernie Sanders. He's a true visionary for how great the United States could be.
|
|
|
Member Since: 2/2/2014
Posts: 9,645
|
...... if Hilary gets the democratic vote I will vote trump and let him be empeached
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 7,726
|
Neither inspire me. I guess Bernie. Hilary is a liar and just wants to be president to be president.
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/31/2013
Posts: 9,758
|
Hillary because she is the most qualified for the job & experience with foreign relations will be crucially important within the next few years.
What did she do wrong that has everyone angry at her? Something to do with emails?
|
|
|
|
|