| |
-->
News: GrExit: "Greece in Auschwitz"
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 8,420
|
The Greek government has put themselves in this position. You cannot allow your country's financial position to deteriorate then refuse to allow at least some spending cuts because you oppose austerity. All the European countries (even those outside of the Eurozone) have had to go through some significant cuts to public expenditure as a result of the crisis. I oppose austerity in the UK right now where we have already went through the hard times and are quite far down the path to recovery. I realise that there have already been cuts to public services in Greece, but there has been no concerted and consistent effort to regain control of Greece's finances, and now it is being turned into an ideological debate with Greece's creditors, particularly Germany, being villainised when the incompetence lies firmly with the Greek government. For too long Greece has been allowed to run rampant and now the other Eurozone countries need to put their foot down. Goodbye!
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/4/2014
Posts: 8,187
|
Quote:
Originally posted by RomanNavy
Don't cry for me Argentina Greece
 |
y'all are ruthless 
How did Greece even get in this predicament?
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 39,572
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Rusty
Semantics are important. The EU doesn't equal the Eurozone. The Eurozone/euro currency may bomb if other countries have to exit, but the EU can still basically exists even if it's just Germany and France (though that won't happen).
|
But what we have to remember is that the whole point of the EU is 'ever closer union', just the act of being able to back out of the Eurozone will be enough to show this up, which is why Merkel is trying her hardest not to allow it.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 6/3/2011
Posts: 14,194
|
So what exactly are they voting on July 5th? 
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 8,420
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Cz!
So what exactly are they voting on July 5th? |
An unfinished deal that they already decided they don't want and that has now been removed from the offering table 
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 7,705
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Blue Jeans
I'm surprised they are not Romania, Bulgaria, Lithuania. Interesting that their economies are doing better than the older European countries
|
Greece is well known ever since the WW II that they are uncapable of saving money and spending more then what they have... like even back in the 80s there were jokes about greeks debt... oh well, hope euro wont collapse after this, but I doubt it, euro is strong as ha baby mama germany so...
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 39,572
|
Quote:
Originally posted by LadyDiana
this is so Germany right now
|
If I were Germany, I'd be ******** myself right now, it's a big deal.
Quote:
Originally posted by MillionLights
The Greek government has put themselves in this position. You cannot allow your country's financial position to deteriorate then refuse to allow at least some spending cuts because you oppose austerity. All the European countries (even those outside of the Eurozone) have had to go through some significant cuts to public expenditure as a result of the crisis. I oppose austerity in the UK right now where we have already went through the hard times and are quite far down the path to recovery. I realise that there have already been cuts to public services in Greece, but there has been no concerted and consistent effort to regain control of Greece's finances, and now it is being turned into an ideological debate with Greece's creditors, particularly Germany, being villainised when the incompetence lies firmly with the Greek government. For too long Greece has been allowed to run rampant and now the other Eurozone countries need to put their foot down. Goodbye!
|
All jokes/positive side-effects aside, the creditors have been too much as well, they knew he didn't have a mandate for spending cuts, but wouldn't accept his tax increases as a compromise.
Quote:
Originally posted by Cz!
So what exactly are they voting on July 5th? |
To accept the bailout or not, which is pointless as they'll already have defaulted. It's basically a way for Tsipras to be able to say it isn't his fault.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 7,352
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Blue Jeans
I'm surprised they are not Romania, Bulgaria, Lithuania. Interesting that their economies are doing better than the older European countries
|
Bulgaria and Romanoa don't even ise the Euro and the Baltic countries are actually doing very good, despite the economic crisis
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 31,020
|
Quote:
Originally posted by LadyDiana
um Greece won't leave EU, it's not that simple, they "only" want to leave euro, they believe that by printing infinitive amaount of their own money the'll be able to pay for everything...
I think Fourth Reic... pardon, European Union is safe, but Greece is about to eat some nasty **** in the next few years... |
Time to get to work after decades of being lazy, we won't be giving our taxes for Greeks who retire in their 40s.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2013
Posts: 15,264
|
I can already see a new talent show being born.... Will they join Russia or Turkey?
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 39,572
|
Quote:
Originally posted by MillionLights
An unfinished deal that they already decided they don't want and that has now been removed from the offering table |
My understanding is that they were made an offer yesterday which the Greeks initially rejected, and Tsipras is giving the people the choice to accept it or not, so that he isn't seen as the one who accepted Austerity and went back on his promises. It was that or snap elections.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 3/14/2013
Posts: 19,483
|
Which Greek ATRLer reported this thread? You don't get to choose Greece's spotlight today. 
------
This is pretty bad. But from everything I've read up on this, Greece put themselves in this position. There's no point in trying to get them to see reason when they refuse to accept most if not all of the responsibility. Sure wouldn't want to be in Greece here on out.
|
|
|
|
Banned
Member Since: 9/12/2011
Posts: 9,897
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Rusty
This isn't really fair. Countries that were bailed out like Ireland and Portugal have done remarkably, particularly the former who is paying billions back year-on-year and about to exit the bailout conditions entirely after paying back its loans with interest. The single market is supposed to help a country that hits a problem because it affects all other countries, especially those in the eurozone.
Greece's problems existed before the single market, and they all came to a head with the global recession. In the long run this will be fine for the EU after a negative bump due to a debt write off, but Greece itself is essentially going to collapse. They will have no money and when they start to get their currency off the ground it will be worth almost nothing next to other Western currencies. They won't be able to borrow from anywhere really... This situation hasn't happened before. There really is no telling what will happen.
|
The entire second paragraph unfortunately... I mean EU will pull through, and global economy will struggle (as greece's economy makes up for merely 2% of the whole eurozone) for a bit but in the end It'll stabilize. Greece on other hand has nothing to hold on to and its economy will crush undoubtedly.. Good luck my greek sistrens. Hopefully it all ends well for y'all.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 8,420
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Dilettante
All jokes/positive side-effects aside, the creditors have been too much as well, they knew he didn't have a mandate for spending cuts, but wouldn't accept his tax increases as a compromise. |
Well we all know the stereotype about the Greeks and their taxes.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 8,420
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Dilettante
My understanding is that they were made an offer yesterday which the Greeks initially rejected, and Tsipras is giving the people the choice to accept it or not, so that he isn't seen as the one who accepted Austerity and went back on his promises. It was that or snap elections.
|
Yep, but during the press conference they said that the deal wasn't even finished when the Greek delegation decided to leave http://www.theguardian.com/business/...ministers-live
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 39,572
|
Quote:
Originally posted by MillionLights
Well we all know the stereotype about the Greeks and their taxes.
|
I actually don't, but I assume it's something negative.
Is anyone living in Greece right now? Will they vote yes or no?
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/4/2014
Posts: 8,187
|
marina and the diamonds reported the thread, she dont like y'all coming for her paternal ancestry
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 16,371
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Dilettante
But what we have to remember is that the whole point of the EU is 'ever closer union', just the act of being able to back out of the Eurozone will be enough to show this up, which is why Merkel is trying her hardest not to allow it.
|
That's hardly fair. I bet she'd be commended at home to let Greece go, I bet it's an unpopular thing in Germany to give tens of billions to other nations whose policies show they have no intention (at least in the short term) of stemming their deficit and paying back the cash. The EU is important since it's easy for European countries to become isolated leading to major dilemmas; I don't even think the UK will exit tbh, just have our position in the Union changed to alter immigration and few other more minor details.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 2/15/2010
Posts: 26,141
|
Won't the collapse of Greece only cause for more problems though? Won't there be a huge chaos there and won't people try to flee to other European countries? As if the EU doesn't have enough immigration problems as it is..
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 39,572
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Rusty
That's hardly fair. I bet she'd be commended at home to let Greece go, I bet it's an unpopular thing in Germany to give tens of billions to other nations whose policies show they have no intention (at least in the short term) of stemming their deficit and paying back the cash. The EU is important since it's easy for European countries to become isolated leading to major dilemmas; I don't even think the UK will exit tbh, just have our position in the Union changed to alter immigration and few other more minor details.
|
The people generally just think it'd be easier for them to impose austerity; the point now is that the German people are getting frustrated, but Merkel is thinking about her legacy, and doesn't want to be seen as the Chancellor who oversaw the beginning of the end of the EU, which would possibly happen, if things are kept unchecked.
I hope Portugal/Spain are preparing, if Greece default or leave then the speculation will be on who is next.
|
|
|
|
|
|
