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Poll: Is 1989 era already more successful than the LOUD era?
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View Poll Results: Is 1989 already more successful than LOUD era?
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Yes it is/Yes it will be
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227 |
79.93% |
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No
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57 |
20.07% |
ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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Quote:
Originally posted by Deemy
Agreed its not a discussion need to be had. Shake It Off in my eyes is still the bigger "hit" but their sales can be compared because there's no chart manipulation in clicking purchase on iTunes. Shake It Off's sales is a bit underwhelming when you take into account the promotion, the big first week and hype that Taylor has... but when you put into perspective that her album is over 4M sold in the US everything else is irrelevant.
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See, I mostly agree - I just don't think it's appropriate to compare SIO's sales to virtually any of Rihanna's hits' sales. Even Stay, her most recent massive hit, was released before sales significantly nosedived and before streaming started to leech off sales. One has to account for streaming; even though stay had more sales, like you said SIO was the bigger hit, by virtue of streaming. The amount of manipulation that goes into streaming is honestly minimal.
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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Quote:
Originally posted by lonnie
Sales never dropped so drastically to the point that there was such a big margin in only two weeks, I don't know what you're trying to prove with this.
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.... exactly. Stay was probably not released when decreases for the aggregated total in 2013 were even beginning to take place, and its total was therefore not far from what it would have sold in 2012 when digital track sales peaked. SIO by comparison was released in late 2014, the second year in which sales fell. An adjustment should be made if we're comparing pure sales and no streaming, and even then SIO (which would still be slightly lower) is still selling decently. Comparing Stay's sales to SIO in response to the user whose comment started all this, while also having nothing to do with the Loud era, is not a good method of argument because of both the factor that sales have fallen since Stay was big and the factor that SIO is by no means done with its chart run.
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Member Since: 8/17/2013
Posts: 19,066
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One year is not going to account for some massive change in sales. Just b/c sales peaked one year doesn't mean that is the standard amount something "should sell", where you can adjust for lost copies. It doesn't work that way. 1989 itself proved this.
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Member Since: 1/2/2014
Posts: 18,038
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LOUD also sold more about everywhere else that isn't the U.S, and WMN?, only girl and S&M were bigger hits worldwide than the singles from 1989.
Taylor sold less than 2 million everywhere else while Rihanna sold more than 4 million everywhere else.
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Member Since: 9/21/2010
Posts: 29,122
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Quote:
Originally posted by Arioso
See, I mostly agree - I just don't think it's appropriate to compare SIO's sales to virtually any of Rihanna's hits' sales. Even Stay, her most recent massive hit, was released before sales significantly nosedived and before streaming started to leech off sales. One has to account for streaming; even though stay had more sales, like you said SIO was the bigger hit, by virtue of streaming. The amount of manipulation that goes into streaming is honestly minimal.
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But speaking of Streaming... Taylor's songs are not available for streaming so her sales aren't affected. See, there's always two sides. She doesnt have Spotify affecting her sales.
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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Quote:
Originally posted by BlueTimberwolf
One year is not going to account for some massive change in sales. Just b/c sales peaked one year doesn't mean that is the standard amount something "should sell", where you can adjust for lost copies. It doesn't work that way. 1989 itself proved this.
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Okay, you're still not acknowledging my other point that SIO is not done selling. It's literally still top ten on iTunes.
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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Quote:
Originally posted by Deemy
But speaking of Streaming... Taylor's songs are not available for streaming so her sales aren't affected. See, there's always two sides. She doesnt have Spotify affecting her sales.
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True. She still does have a marginal decrease in sales because of general falls in sales, but that's also a very good point that on-demand services aren't hurting her. 
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Member Since: 8/17/2013
Posts: 19,066
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Quote:
Originally posted by Arioso
Okay, you're still not acknowledging my other point that SIO is not done selling. It's literally still top ten on iTunes.
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Well, until actually does so and surpasses Rih sales, I'm not going to act like it did.
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 30,642
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not yet 
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Member Since: 1/27/2006
Posts: 51,546
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SIO would be nearing 6 million without complete my album. So it can't be underwhelming since it had a disadvantage it could not escape under Billboard rules. Those "missing" sales all went back into the album.
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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Quote:
Originally posted by BlueTimberwolf
Well, until actually does so and surpasses Rih sales, I'm not going to act like it did.
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Acting like it did isn't the point - knowing that it will, since it's selling 100k per week, is the point. 
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Member Since: 1/2/2014
Posts: 18,038
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Quote:
Originally posted by Arioso
.... exactly. Stay was probably not released when decreases for the aggregated total in 2013 were even beginning to take place, and its total was therefore not far from what it would have sold in 2012 when digital track sales peaked. SIO by comparison was released in late 2014, the second year in which sales fell. An adjustment should be made if we're comparing pure sales and no streaming, and even then SIO (which would still be slightly lower) is still selling decently. Comparing Stay's sales to SIO in response to the user whose comment started all this, while also having nothing to do with the Loud era, is not a good method of argument because of both the factor that sales have fallen since Stay was big and the factor that SIO is by no means done with its chart run.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Deemy
But speaking of Streaming... Taylor's songs are not available for streaming so her sales aren't affected. See, there's always two sides. She doesnt have Spotify affecting her sales.
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Took the words right out of my mouth..
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Member Since: 9/21/2010
Posts: 29,122
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rico Shameless v2
SIO would be nearing 6 million without complete my album. So it can't be underwhelming since it had a disadvantage it could not escape under Billboard rules. Those "missing" sales all went back into the album.
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I acknowledged that but its overlooked lol. I said Shake It Off is still the bigger hit regardless if it didnt outsell Stay because its parent album is over 4M in sales in the US.
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Member Since: 8/17/2013
Posts: 19,066
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Quote:
Originally posted by Deemy
I acknowledged that but its overlooked lol. I said Shake It Off is still the bigger hit regardless if it didnt outsell Stay because its parent album is over 4M in sales in the US.
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Not exactly. Plenty of albums have huge sales with only moderate hits, like 1D. That doessn't make the songs themselves bigger.
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Member Since: 1/27/2006
Posts: 51,546
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Quote:
Originally posted by Deemy
I acknowledged that but its overlooked lol. I said Shake It Off is still the bigger hit regardless if it didnt outsell Stay because its parent album is over 4M in sales in the US.
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Well you said they were underwhelming despite promo/hype, which is false since either without CMA/if it was standalone, its sales would reflect from all she had behind her.
Quote:
Originally posted by BlueTimberwolf
Not exactly. Plenty of albums have huge sales with only moderate hits, like 1D. That doessn't make the songs themselves bigger.
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He didn't say that was the case all the time.
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Banned
Member Since: 11/24/2009
Posts: 61,404
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SIO has been in the top 10 of iTunes since August of last year  . And it started selling huge right off the bat (500k+ first week). It even had holiday sales. So it's been selling well for like 6 months straight. Its sales suffered greatly from CMA. Otherwise it would easily be at 5M+.
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Member Since: 1/2/2014
Posts: 18,038
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rico Shameless v2
Well you said they were underwhelming despite promo/hype, which is false since either without CMA/if it was standalone, its sales would reflect from all she had behind her.
He didn't say that was the case all the time.
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But it is the case all the time 
How big a song is, is never affected by how big the parent album is. How big the album is only affects how big the era is. So SIO can't be bigger when it sold less and got less views and less streaming despite the more hype and promo just because 1989 sold a lot
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 15,836
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Quote:
Originally posted by lonnie
Stay still has over 400 million views despite being blocked for a while, more than SIO if I'm not wrong
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In fact, you are wrong. Very wrong actually!
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Member Since: 8/17/2013
Posts: 19,066
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rico Shameless v2
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He didn't say that was the case all the time.
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What makes it the case this time?
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Member Since: 9/1/2013
Posts: 22,540
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This thread is still going? 
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