Is mulatto a bad thing, though? I'm from Mexico and it doesn't have a negative connotation here, and I've never heard of "Redbone". Is that racist? Help me out with this American jargon.
Mulatto is different in American history than it is in Central/South American history.
In the US, they had the one drop rule–any amount of black ancestry made you a black person and thus less than human. White slave owners would rape their Black slaves, and the resulting half white/half black child would be called "mulatto." Then you have terms like quadroon for children of one mulatto parent and one white parent, octaroon for someone with a Black grandparent, and mustefino/quintroon/hexadecaroon for those with one Black great-grandparent. These terms were used to separate and discriminate against those who were not "pure White." The terms are outdated and were snatched from the census in the 1930s. Anyone still using it in reference to Black women is TRASH.
Redbone is a term used in the black community, as is yellowbone, and there's a lot of controversy around it in the community because many feel it also degrades dark skinned women—a form of internalized racism. A white man has NO right to use those terms.
gerl i don't think jace knows about these complex things, i don't see anything racist in that convo, stop the mess and focus on the transphobia
I actually never knew the history behind "mulatto" before. Slave trade isn't something we go very depth into here, unless you take American History, which I didn't. That's really informative and good to know, though. I've heard it used a lot before, even by teachers in my classrooms, and never thought anything of it. Glad I found all that out before I started throwing it around myself.
Does it have a similar history/connotation in Europe?
Just because Jace doesn't KNOW the history of the word, doesn't mean the usage of the WORD isn't still racist.
As if White people in 2015 still calling Black people the N word know the complex history behind the word
Or White people participating in Blackface understand the deep significance behind it's formation
Racism is a topic that's very important to me and I'm not gonna sit here and listen to that trash
Get the hell off of my quote button with that crap
I actually never knew the history behind "mulatto" before. Slave trade isn't something we go very depth into here, unless you take American History, which I didn't. That's really informative and good to know, though. I've heard it used a lot before, even by teachers in my classrooms, and I never thought anything of it.
Does it have a similar history/connotation in Europe?
I have no idea about in Europe, but I doubt it just because it comes directly from the slave culture that existed in America.
That's the reason why a lot of our European members don't see the racism in certain things or words that we do; it's because they don't have the same historical context. Context is incredibly important, and that's proven by Dancefloor saying that the word isn't offensive, which it is not in her Mexican context.
Quote:
Originally posted by Johnny Mac
Nooooooooooooooooooooooooo.
Nooooooooooo.
Nooooooo.
Not today. Leave Jeff alone. I have to deal with that video/comment EVERY year.
I just saw it on Tumblr for the first time, it's so highkey messy.
Just because Jace doesn't KNOW the history of the word, doesn't mean the usage of the WORD isn't still racist.
As if White people in 2015 still calling Black people the N word know the complex history behind the word
Or White people participating in Blackface understand the deep significance behind it's formation
Racism is a topic that's very important to me and I'm not gonna sit here and listen to that trash
Get the hell off of my quote button with that crap
---------
I've never seen this before kmlgh;;lfh
when he went
posh, how did you forgive this?
that's why others have said, it's ignorant not racist. How many people, even black, know that mulatto is derogatory? Or redbone? And jace even said "i don't think it's derogatory" so that clearly explains he was ignorant, not racist.
As for shelli and clay, what is racist about what they say? Dark and light skin is not racist, and saying she likes latte colored people is neither...
You need to differentiate from ignorance and racism.
I'm from Europe, I did not know mulatto is somewhat derogatory, does that make me a racist?
On the other hand, the transphobic people KNOW someone is a girl because she said it but still call her a boy/want to see her naked to check/say she has a penis/etc.
Jeff/Clay/Shelli, none of them are racist. The tumblr girls are getting their thongs in a wad cause they need to be mad about something at all times. Their preferences are disappointing to realize, but that's their preference. I will not fault them for not preferring whatever they don't prefer. In the same way, I don't think Jason is transphobic, he made a slick comment that could be misconstrued, but there was no malice intended. None of these people are on the level of an Aaryn who is ACTUALLY racist and said things with MALICE and intent to hurt.
Can we PLEASE move on from this ridiculous convo and get back to just dragging the HGs cause this **** is TIRED, THROUGH and DELAYED.
Mulatto is different in American history than it is in Central/South American history.
In the US, they had the one drop rule–any amount of black ancestry made you a black person and thus less than human. White slave owners would rape their Black slaves, and the resulting half white/half black child would be called "mulatto." Then you have terms like quadroon for children of one mulatto parent and one white parent, octaroon for someone with a Black grandparent, and mustefino/quintroon/hexadecaroon for those with one Black great-grandparent. These terms were used to separate and discriminate against those who were not "pure White." The terms are outdated and were snatched from the census in the 1930s. Anyone still using it in reference to Black women is TRASH.
Redbone is a term used in the black community, as is yellowbone, and there's a lot of controversy around it in the community because many feel it also degrades dark skinned women—a form of internalized racism. A white man has NO right to use those terms.
Oh I knew about the one-drop rule, and I read many cases of people who looked white, but were considered black because they had African-American ancestry. I took an Anthropology course at my university. However, I didn't know about those terms, I never heard of them before. Only mulatto which, like I said, in Latin America has kind of an exotic meaning. Thank you for the info, though. One must always adapt to different cultures and be respectful about it.
Something similar happened in Mexico when Spanish colonizers came here. It was called the "castas" system. Of course indigenous people and black slaves were at the bottom of the totem pole. The ones at the top were European whites, but even whites born in the Americas were considered to have less rights; they were called "criollos", and many of them started the Independence war. Then there's the "mestizos" who are people with European and Indigenous ancestry. However, this system was shunned a long, long time ago, and our census doesn't even ask about race. Most of us identify ourselves as "mestizos", even people who are very dark skinned and people white with blue eyes because we all assume we must have some indigenous blood in us. I never understood Hispanic White, tbh.
I have no idea about in Europe, but I doubt it just because it comes directly from the slave culture that existed in America.
That's the reason why a lot of our European members don't see the racism in certain things or words that we do; it's because they don't have the same historical context. Context is incredibly important, and that's proven by Dancefloor saying that the word isn't offensive, which it is not in her Mexican context.
I don't live in America either, and I grew up thinking that mulatto was the proper term for someone that was mix-raced (black/white), that's literally what I was taught. Of course, that doesn't take away the history of the word at all, nor does it excuse anyone of using the word without being fully aware of the context. I'm reading a little more into it now on a separate site, and I'm kind of shocked that about how much it's casually thrown around today.
I've never even heard the term "red-bone" before today.
Quote:
I just saw it on Tumblr for the first time, it's so highkey messy.
Honestly, it was pretty messy, but he isn't a bad of a guy as that isolated incident would lead you to believe. He spent two summers with a gay male, and he never maliciously attacked them because of their sexuality. Jeff's main issue with Dumbledore was that he felt it represented a poor side of the gay community. He saw it as a gay man that trapped kids inside a castle where he could play with them, which made him uncomfortable. He doesn't hate Dumbledore because he's gay, but because of the stereotypes that he's been conditioned to believe. He never went out of his way to make any of the gay HGs feel bad though, nor was he derogatory towards them. He isn't a bad guy - just a little ignorant. He was swiftly educated on his mistakes after leaving the house though, so you need not worry. He's a better man now.
My poor innocent baby. At least America still loves him.
Most of us identify ourselves as "mestizos", even people who are very dark skinned and people white with blue eyes because we all assume we must have some indigenous blood in us. I never understood Hispanic White, tbh.
Being shocked that someone would like Black women IS racist.
Being incredulous that someone would marry a Black woman IS racist.
Saying that you have to be careful to choose light skinned Black women over dark skinned Black women IS racist.
Calling Black women mulatto IS racist.
Calling Black women "redbone" or "yellowbone" whether or not you think it's okay IS racist.
Reducing Black women the degree of Blackness of their skin IS racist.
Fetishizing Brazilian bodies IS racist.
No one is saying that those people are evil racist KKK members,
but what they did is completely WRONG and OFFENSIVE to MANY people.
Black women go through hearing **** like that every ****ing DAY, this is REAL to MANY people.
We could LITERALLY move on if y'all would acknowledge that,
but you continue to make excuses and I'm not having it.
Being shocked that someone would like Black women IS racist.
Being incredulous that someone would marry a Black woman IS racist.
Saying that you have to be careful to choose light skinned Black women over dark skinned Black women IS racist.
Calling Black women mulatto IS racist.
Calling Black women "redbone" or "yellowbone" whether or not you think it's okay IS racist.
Reducing Black women the degree of Blackness of their skin IS racist.
Fetishizing Brazilian bodies IS racist.
No one is saying that those people are evil racist KKK members,
but what they did is completely WRONG and OFFENSIVE to MANY people.
Black women go through hearing **** like that every ****ing DAY, this is REAL to MANY people.
We could LITERALLY move on if y'all would acknowledge that,
but you continue to make excuses and I'm not having it.
Oh no. Clay's question: "the dark ones or the light ones?" is awful, and when Jace told him he liked black girls Clay made a grimace. GOOD-BYE.
Is mulatto a bad thing, though? I'm from Mexico and it doesn't have a negative connotation here, and I've never heard of "Redbone". Is that racist? Help me out with this American jargon.
Words like Colored, Mullato, & Negro aren't really seen as offensive as they are more outdated. It's more so that those three words were used heavily during slavery/Jim Crow era, thus kinda serve as a reminder, but I wouldn't say they're really offensive. Plus the US did away with those word's once they adopted the one drop rule that everyone black, no matter if you looked like Mariah Carey or Lupita N'yongo. So they're more outdated than they are offensive tbh.
They're perfectly ok in places like South America, The Caribbean, & South Africa where there's a more strict definition of black or people identify as mixed more quickly. Black Americans don't really like separating black people in categories like that. (Even though that's still a damn problem even within the damn community. )
I have no idea about in Europe, but I doubt it just because it comes directly from the slave culture that existed in America.
That's the reason why a lot of our European members don't see the racism in certain things or words that we do; it's because they don't have the same historical context. Context is incredibly important, and that's proven by Dancefloor saying that the word isn't offensive, which it is not in her Mexican context.
Exactly. And I agree, just because to me it isn't offensive in my social spectrum, it doesn't mean I'd go around unapologetically calling people mulattos in a place/country where it has a negative meaning. Respect above all.
Oh I knew about the one-drop rule, and I read many cases of people who looked white, but were considered black because they had African-American ancestry. I took an Anthropology course at my university. However, I didn't know about those terms, I never heard of them before. Only mulatto which, like I said, in Latin America has kind of an exotic meaning. Thank you for the info, though. One must always adapt to different cultures and be respectful about it.
Something similar happened in Mexico when Spanish colonizers came here. It was called the "castas" system. Of course indigenous people and black slaves were at the bottom of the totem pole. The ones at the top were European whites, but even whites born in the Americas were considered to have less rights; they were called "criollos", and many of them started the Independence war. Then there's the "mestizos" who are people with European and Indigenous ancestry. However, this system was shunned a long, long time ago, and our census doesn't even ask about race. Most of us identify ourselves as "mestizos", even people who are very dark skinned and people white with blue eyes because we all assume we must have some indigenous blood in us. I never understood Hispanic White, tbh.
Thanks for that information! I didn't know anything about that "castas" system. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like the terms in both cultures stem from racist backgrounds, but the difference is that the US trashed it and did away with the word, while your culture threw away all of the negative ideology behind the word and kept it as a word to just describe people (like Black or White).
Quote:
Originally posted by Johnny Mac
I don't live in America either, and I grew up thinking that mulatto was the proper term for someone that was mix-raced (black/white), that's literally what I was taught. Of course, that doesn't take away the history of the word at all, nor does it excuse anyone of using the word without being fully aware of the context. I'm reading a little more into it now on a separate site, and I'm kind of shocked that about how much it's casually thrown around today.
I've never even heard the term "red-bone" before today.
Honestly, it was pretty messy, but he isn't a bad of a guy as that isolated incident would lead you to believe. He spent two summers with a gay male, and he never maliciously attacked them because of their sexuality. Jeff's main issue with Dumbledore was that he felt it represented a poor side of the gay community. He saw it as a gay man that trapped kids inside a castle where he could play with them, which made him uncomfortable. He doesn't hate Dumbledore because he's gay, but because of the stereotypes that he's been conditioned to believe. He never went out of his way to make any of the gay HGs feel bad though, nor was he derogatory towards them. He isn't a bad guy - just a little ignorant. He was swiftly educated on his mistakes after leaving the house though, so you need not worry. He's a better man now.
My poor innocent baby. At least America still loves him.
Yeah, I can't fault you for what you were taught outside of America. That's not your fault and I'm glad you're so willing to learn more about it. The crazy thing is that the word "mulatto" was thrown out of the census in the 1930s because they knew it was wrong—all the while while the N word was still seen as okay. That word hasn't been part of popular vocabulary for DECADES in America, which is why it's so shocking and bothersome to hear a White American all of a sudden start using it. It's incredibly outdated and offensive.
Slave trade isn't something we go very depth into here, unless you take American History, which I didn't. That's really informative and good to know, though. I've heard it used a lot before, even by teachers in my classrooms, and never thought anything of it. Glad I found all that out before I started throwing it around myself.
He never went out of his way to make any of the gay HGs feel bad though, nor was he derogatory towards them. He isn't a bad guy - just a little ignorant. He was swiftly educated on his mistakes after leaving the house though, so you need not worry. He's a better man now.
My poor innocent baby. At least America still loves him.
