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Chart Listings: US Airplay Discussion Thread (Dec 2012 - July 2013)
ATRL Contributor
Member Since: 11/5/2011
Posts: 100,491
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Member Since: 2/6/2012
Posts: 29,767
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Quote:
Originally posted by Pop pop123
Take a look at those songs, they are not strictly pop songs.
Most of them are multi format/cross over type songs.
The panel IS bigger Now, top 40 has way more AI and spins compared to 2005.
The dance craze doesn't help today artist at all.
Do you think a generic pop or dance song can cross over to urban?
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Prove it. Show me receipts that panel is bigger (even a top 10 from then and now will do).
Second point is irrelevant since there are plenty of multiplatform hits nowadays. Dancepop is the ONE exception, but there is no reason why another combination not including Urban could pull it off. It makes NO sense to simply claim that modern songs don't have crossover appeal.
The top 10 of all time CLEARLY shows that it was FAR easier to achieve those massive AI numbers then than it is now. Even if the panel is bigger (I am skeptical), it goes to show how much harder it is now, which only makes BL's MORE impressive..... not less.
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ATRL Administrator
Member Since: 6/29/2002
Posts: 77,601
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Mariah was #1 on Pop/Rhythmic/Urban/Urban AC at the same time. But only barely top 20 on HAC, due to that format's refusal to play music by black artists.
Blurred Lines is #1 on Pop/Rhythmic, will be #1 soon on Urban and maybe also on Urban AC. BUT, it's also heading to #1 on HAC. So the reduced racism is helping it break Mariah's record.
I do think Mariah was more impressive, as there was less AI "available" at the time. Just compare the top 15 then to now.
1. Mariah Carey - We Belong Together: 253.218 (-0.665)
2. Gwen Stefani - Hollaback Girl: 115.572 (-1.764)
3. Bow Wow ft. Omarion - Let Me Hold You: 102.095 (+2.244)
4. Pretty Ricky - Grind With Me: 97.615 (-1.116)
5. 50 Cent - Just A Lil' Bit: 96.513 (-1.753)
6. Kelly Clarkson - Behind These Hazel Eyes: 91.826 (+0.549)
7. Rihanna - Pon De Replay: 86.244
8. Black Eyed Peas - Don't Phunk With My Heart: 83.167
9. Ciara - Oh: 80.941
10. Fat Joe ft. Nelly - Get It Poppin: 80.328
11. Ludacris - Pimpin' All Over The World: 79.012
12. Destiny's Child - Cater 2 U: 64.607
13. D.H.T. - Listen To Your Heart: 60.322
14. Pussycat Dolls - Don't Cha: 58.235
15. Fantasia - Free Yourself: 58.039
1. ROBIN THICKE Blurred Lines f/Pharrell & T.I: 242.385 (+ 1.967)
2. DAFT PUNK Get Lucky: 178.656 (+ 0.052)
3. IMAGINE DRAGONS Radioactive: 151.652 (+ 1.747)
4. JUSTIN TIMBERLAKE Mirrors: 144.128 (- 1.266)
5. MAROON 5 Love Somebody: 121.010 (+ 2.008)
6. BRUNO MARS Treasure: 118.076 (+ 1.291)
7. MACKLEMORE & RYAN LEWIS Cant Hold Us f/Ray Dalton: 105.288 (- 2.309)
8. ZEDD Clarity f/Foxes: 102.520 (+ 2.134)
9. MACKLEMORE & RYAN LEWIS Same Love f/Mary Lambert: 95.700 (+ 1.222) ▲
10. PINK Just Give Me A Reason: 94.906 (- 0.372) ▼
11. JASON DERULO The Other Side: 87.975 (+ 0.225)
12. ANNA KENDRICK Cups (Pitch Perfects When
: 84.535 (+ 1.812)
13. FLORIDA-GEORGIA LINE Cruise f/Nelly: 81.054 (- 1.272)
14. CALVIN HARRIS F/ELLIE GOULDING I Need Your Love: 76.499 (+ 0.204)
15. CAPITAL CITIES Safe And Sound: 75.427 (+ 1.700) ▲
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Member Since: 2/6/2012
Posts: 29,767
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Quote:
Originally posted by highwind44029
This is how audiences were weighed across Pop/Rhythmic/Urban during WBT's time:
Pop - #1 song is at around 70M
Rhythmic - #1 song is at around 80M
Urban - #1 song is at around 70M
Total - 220M
compared to now:
Pop - #1 song is at around 110M
Rhythmic - #1 song is at around 40M
Urban - #1 song is at around 40M
Total - 190M
Panels back then are still bigger in comparison overall, and panels back then gave an innate advantage to R&B and hip-hop songs because of how skewed the audience were towards the two main radio formats that play those types of songs.
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Thank you. Knew they were just blowing smoke.\
Edit: Those aren't from the panel Billboard uses though Kworb. In this specific case I don't think they can be compared since a huge part of the discussion was the specific weight that genres are given. Which varies from tracker to tracker.
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Member Since: 10/1/2011
Posts: 53,790
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Quote:
Originally posted by NickLacheyFan
I edited my post, I'm not on top of the data when it comes to radio back in 2005.
But if you already went there than there were few songs peaking around the 200m mark the last year, it was bound to happen that someone will break that record so it makes every sense.
If any, Mariah record held for years which is more impressive while I'm pretty sure BL record will be broken in the next year or two unless something will happen to the panel.
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I guess. If it took eight years to do it with a panel that's not as inflated as it was in 05/06, I'm sure it'll probably take another few years for BL's record to be broken.
It's not exactly a common occurrence. Songs reach 200M on Mediabase but that aren't seeing that on Billboard.
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Member Since: 6/3/2011
Posts: 14,194
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Quote:
Originally posted by NickLacheyFan
I'm from Israel and the song is getting more than a fair amount of radio play and downloads.
It just didn't make any impact on my friends or people around me.
BL is not a bad song but it doesn't got that "IT" factor, at least for me.
I don't see people in 10 years listening to this song and laying back going like "Damn, what a masterpiece", while we are almost 10 years in on WBT and I for once, and not only me, doing it.
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Then again, that's YOUR OPINION. BL will have its public. Your logic:
Quote:
"Me and my two closest friends and my mum and my dog love "Laffy Taffy". It's the biggest song ever recorded. Such a masterpiece. I don't care about peaks because my dog loves it!!!!"
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It doesn't work like this. ![toofunny2](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v232/korn0818/ATRL_Smilies_All/faces/toofunny2_zpsb54f2d2d.gif)
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Member Since: 6/25/2008
Posts: 20,616
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kworb
Mariah was #1 on Pop/Rhythmic/Urban/Urban AC at the same time. But only barely top 20 on HAC, due to that format's refusal to play music by black artists.
Blurred Lines is #1 on Pop/Rhythmic, will be #1 soon on Urban and maybe also on Urban AC. BUT, it's also heading to #1 on HAC. So the reduced racism is helping it break Mariah's record.
I do think Mariah was more impressive, as there was less AI "available" at the time. Just compare the top 15 then to now.
1. Mariah Carey - We Belong Together: 253.218 (-0.665)
2. Gwen Stefani - Hollaback Girl: 115.572 (-1.764)
3. Bow Wow ft. Omarion - Let Me Hold You: 102.095 (+2.244)
4. Pretty Ricky - Grind With Me: 97.615 (-1.116)
5. 50 Cent - Just A Lil' Bit: 96.513 (-1.753)
6. Kelly Clarkson - Behind These Hazel Eyes: 91.826 (+0.549)
7. Rihanna - Pon De Replay: 86.244
8. Black Eyed Peas - Don't Phunk With My Heart: 83.167
9. Ciara - Oh: 80.941
10. Fat Joe ft. Nelly - Get It Poppin: 80.328
11. Ludacris - Pimpin' All Over The World: 79.012
12. Destiny's Child - Cater 2 U: 64.607
13. D.H.T. - Listen To Your Heart: 60.322
14. Pussycat Dolls - Don't Cha: 58.235
15. Fantasia - Free Yourself: 58.039
1. ROBIN THICKE – Blurred Lines f/Pharrell & T.I: 242.385 (+ 1.967)
2. DAFT PUNK – Get Lucky: 178.656 (+ 0.052)
3. IMAGINE DRAGONS – Radioactive: 151.652 (+ 1.747)
4. JUSTIN TIMBERLAKE – Mirrors: 144.128 (- 1.266)
5. MAROON 5 – Love Somebody: 121.010 (+ 2.008)
6. BRUNO MARS – Treasure: 118.076 (+ 1.291)
7. MACKLEMORE & RYAN LEWIS – Can’t Hold Us f/Ray Dalton: 105.288 (- 2.309)
8. ZEDD – Clarity f/Foxes: 102.520 (+ 2.134)
9. MACKLEMORE & RYAN LEWIS – Same Love f/Mary Lambert: 95.700 (+ 1.222) ▲
10. PINK – Just Give Me A Reason: 94.906 (- 0.372) ▼
11. JASON DERULO – The Other Side: 87.975 (+ 0.225)
12. ANNA KENDRICK – Cups (Pitch Perfect’s When…: 84.535 (+ 1.812)
13. FLORIDA-GEORGIA LINE – Cruise f/Nelly: 81.054 (- 1.272)
14. CALVIN HARRIS F/ELLIE GOULDING – I Need Your Love: 76.499 (+ 0.204)
15. CAPITAL CITIES – Safe And Sound: 75.427 (+ 1.700) ▲
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Finally someone who's on top of the numbers.
If you can't get how impressive Mariah record is by looking at the numbers than you got no reason to be on this site.
Quote:
Originally posted by Cz!
Then again, that's YOUR OPINION. BL will have its public. Your logic:
It doesn't work like this. ![toofunny2](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v232/korn0818/ATRL_Smilies_All/faces/toofunny2_zpsb54f2d2d.gif)
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We already made it clear IT'S MY OPINION.
And you know what, sometimes it does work this way.
If you live, love and breath music, sometimes it's not that hard to know what songs will end up being epic and loved for years to come and when something will not.
BL is just not gonna be nostalgic/epic song.
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Member Since: 8/29/2011
Posts: 18,282
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Quote:
Originally posted by Pop pop123
Take a look at those songs, they are not strictly pop songs.
Most of them are multi format/cross over type songs.
The panel IS bigger Now, top 40 has way more AI and spins compared to 2005.
The dance craze doesn't help today artist at all.
Do you think a generic pop or dance song can cross over to urban?
If WBT were released today and smash as it did, it would have easily crossed the 300 million mark without batting an eye lash.
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It is easier for an urban song to pop than the other way around, because all they have to do is make the song a little "poppy", urban stays more true to their genre than most genres would.
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Member Since: 12/15/2008
Posts: 38,248
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Clearly both songs are historic singles that made a huge impact
Done.
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Member Since: 4/21/2009
Posts: 1,472
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Quote:
Originally posted by highwind44029
This is how audiences were weighed across Pop/Rhythmic/Urban during WBT's time:
Pop - #1 song is at around 70M
Rhythmic - #1 song is at around 80M
Urban - #1 song is at around 70M
Total - 220M
compared to now:
Pop - #1 song is at around 110M
Rhythmic - #1 song is at around 40M
Urban - #1 song is at around 40M
Total - 190M
Panels back then are still bigger in comparison.
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Exactly. WBT hit no1 on Pop, Rhythmic, Urban and Urban AC. It was NOT even in the top20 on HOT AC when it reached its airplay peak. it eventually peaked at around no16-17 on HOT AC.
Blurred Lines is/will hit no1 on ALL the formats WBT hit no1 (Pop, Rhythmic, Urban Urban AC) but it is also a MONSTER on HOT AC. In other words, it is a SMASH on all the formats WBT was a smash, plus one more. HOT AC. A very important format.
You can make up your own facts but WBT was NOT a big hit on HOT AC. The inflated Rhythmic and Urban numbers are the reason so many hip-hop/RnB tracks from back then like WBT, Gold Digger and Let Me Love You have so high numbers. At least MiMi had some HOT AC support. Gold Digger and other Hip-Hop songs had literally NO HOT AC support.
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ATRL Administrator
Member Since: 6/29/2002
Posts: 77,601
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Quote:
Originally posted by Waffles_
Thank you. Knew they were just blowing smoke.\
Edit: Those aren't from the panel Billboard uses though Kworb. In this specific case I don't think they can be compared since a huge part of the discussion was the specific weight that genres are given. Which varies from tracker to tracker.
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They can be compared because we want to put the number in context. This shows that 250m then was more impressive than it is now, simply because all the numbers now are higher.
Billboard/Nielsen has also changed the audience weights and panels over time. The comparison will never be perfect.
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Member Since: 11/10/2011
Posts: 14,820
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Quote:
Originally posted by Waffles_
Prove it. Show me receipts that panel is bigger (even a top 10 from then and now will do).
Second point is irrelevant since there are plenty of multiplatform hits nowadays. Dancepop is the ONE exception, but there is no reason why another combination not including Urban could pull it off. It makes NO sense to simply claim that modern songs don't have crossover appeal.
The top 10 of all time CLEARLY shows that it was FAR easier to achieve those massive AI numbers then than it is now. Even if the panel is bigger (I am skeptical), it goes to show how much harder it is now, which only makes BL's MORE impressive..... not less.
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You're right that Pop/rhythmic/urban isn't the only way to get a high AI peak, but I think it's the most common way simply because it's the easiest, and most importantly you can get the songs peaking on each roughly at the same time.
Radioactive by Imagine Dragons, for example, is being played on loads of different formats, but it's so spread out. It's only just entered top 50 on rhythmic, whilst other formats were probably playing it like a year ago. It seems more difficult to get something played on the rock/alternative formats at the same time as pop.
To be honest, pop/country/HAC is probably another way to get a really high AI peak, but only Taylor Swift would be capable of getting it on those formats at the same time. Cruise crossed over, but pop only started playing it ages later.
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Member Since: 2/6/2012
Posts: 29,767
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ger-55
Clearly both songs are historic singles that made a huge impact
Done.
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I see what you did there!
.... there must be a WINNAR!
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Member Since: 10/19/2010
Posts: 16,335
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ger-55
Still. Rhythmic and Urban still being weighted bigger,although I can say it WASN'T thay big difference, since then it's like the amount of Rhythmic and Urban has decreased, goes to Pop, Top 40 pnel has increased pretty much these years
I remember, Rihanna's 2010 smash "What's My Name?" featuring Drake was slaying on both formats but it didn't get there
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It's only because WMN? didn't grow to the maximum audience it could have gotten on Pop. I believe it peaked in the 70's while Firework and Grenade both went over 90M.
Quote:
Originally posted by Kworb
Mariah was #1 on Pop/Rhythmic/Urban/Urban AC at the same time. But only barely top 20 on HAC, due to that format's refusal to play music by black artists.
Blurred Lines is #1 on Pop/Rhythmic, will be #1 soon on Urban and maybe also on Urban AC. BUT, it's also heading to #1 on HAC. So the reduced racism is helping it break Mariah's record.
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Kworb sis
And to think the first artist to hit #1 on HAC/Adult Pop Songs was Seal. ![JonnyϟLightning](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v232/korn0818/ATRL_Smilies_All/atrlers/jonny_zpsc73391c5.png)
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Member Since: 6/3/2011
Posts: 14,194
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Quote:
1. Mariah Carey - We Belong Together: 253.218 (-0.665)
2. Gwen Stefani - Hollaback Girl: 115.572 (-1.764)
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The slayage.
HG was really the GS of its time.
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Member Since: 2/6/2012
Posts: 29,767
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kworb
They can be compared because we want to put the number in context. This shows that 250m then was more impressive than it is now, simply because all the numbers now are higher.
Billboard/Nielsen has also changed the audience weights and panels over time. The comparison will never be perfect.
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Of course, but we also do not know where BL will peak yet either.
It is confusing to compare one chart (where BL's is passing Mariah) to another (where he is still 10 million AI off the record).
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Member Since: 12/15/2008
Posts: 38,248
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Radioactive wins at the end being played by 8 different formats.. it's way more impressive to see how an Alternative song crossover so many different formats ![clap3](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v232/korn0818/67d90ee8.gif)
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ATRL Administrator
Member Since: 6/29/2002
Posts: 77,601
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Quote:
Originally posted by highwind44029
It's only because WMN? didn't grow to the maximum audience it could have gotten on Pop. I believe it peaked in the 70's while Firework and Grenade both went over 90M.
Kworb sis
And to think the first artist to hit #1 on HAC/Adult Pop Songs was Seal. ![JonnyϟLightning](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v232/korn0818/ATRL_Smilies_All/atrlers/jonny_zpsc73391c5.png)
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It was a huge deal at the time. No matter how AC their song, HAC/AC would not touch it if the artist was in any way "urban".
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ATRL Contributor
Member Since: 11/5/2011
Posts: 100,491
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Quote:
Originally posted by Cz!
The slayage.
HG was really the GS of its time.
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but HG went #1 for four weeks before Mariah swooped in ![Fonso](images/smilies/suspicious.gif)
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Member Since: 2/6/2012
Posts: 29,767
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kworb
Blurred Lines is #1 on Pop/Rhythmic, will be #1 soon on Urban and maybe also on Urban AC. BUT, it's also heading to #1 on HAC. So the reduced racism is helping it break Mariah's record.
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Robin is white though.
Though I suppose you could argue that Urban's increased willingness to play white artists is helping out
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