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Discussion: A brain teaser for the homophobics!
Member Since: 7/14/2009
Posts: 22,692
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I'm sorry, but how many of you are republicans? If so I'm thinking you are taking a political stance to this not religious. I only say this because I know many Christians who think there is nothing wrong with being gay.
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Banned
Member Since: 7/15/2007
Posts: 6,502
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Quote:
Originally posted by NE.
The Bible clearly states that homosexual relations with another person of the same-sex is wrong. If you ignore that, you will go to Hell.
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Why did God make us gay in the first place, than?
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Member Since: 10/21/2005
Posts: 19,258
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Quote:
Originally posted by keriihill
Depature (Kevin) why do you ALWAYS have to come for us Christians? SERIOUSLY by opening a thread you entitle us to our opinion! And then you try and bully us by telling us how bad we are because we think being a practicsing homosexual is a sin.
Gays will never be accepted fully into society, just as their is still racisim.
You DONT want this thread to turn into a MESSball.
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Awwww @ you liking me
And why do I go for "you" Christians, when I was brought up as a "Christian" as well? No. I was brought up differently, in a different Church. I was raised to love everyone and everyone and that God loves everyone. Not a God who picks and chooses who he loves based on stuff in a bible.
Also plus the fact, I don't understand how I'm supposed to live my life when all I do is hear Christians telling me I'm going to Hell. How would you like your life if someone told you were doing wrong and you would go to Hell for being who you are. Could you do it?
I didn't accept being gay because of Religion. I'll be honest. I tried being straight. I tried being with girls, which NE disregarded from my post earlier, because he thinks it's such a "choice" to be gay. I finally accepted it around the age 19. but still was kind of in denial because I was scared. People like NE, telling me I'm going to Hell for something I have no control over.
What does he want me to do? Spend the rest of my life alone and unhappy for his God's literature? I don't buy that.
It's NOT a choice to be gay. And if God didn't make you gay, then who did? I didn't choose it. It's not like I'm holding a gun and I have the power to pull the trigger. Being gay isn't like that. It's something that comes from within that we don't understand yet. Nor did God, either. If being gay is done by nature or nurture, what power do we have over that? We can't change that.
You don't choose to fall in love with people. It just happens. You get a tingling feeling inside of you that you haven't felt before. Do you control that feeling inside of you when you are in love? No. But I guess according to NE maybe you do. You guys look at the small picture, when I look at the big picture.
You will get VERY far in life if you do. Time's have changed. People change. I know this. I've seen it before. A alcoholic may be one at one point in life, but in 10 years he could be sober. Some people may have one viewpoint at one time, can't deny that right?, and who says they will keep that viewpoint until forever until end of time? It's not likely to happen. If God hated gay people back then, who says he doesn't now? When times changed?
If people change, why not God? Why do people look into their heart and find compassion for things they've never felt or seen before? Why? Why is the organ (heart) so powerful over the rest? Why do we consider "love" to come from the "heart" and not from any other organ in our body? Why do people forgive? Why do people give out to the people?
No one knows what life is about. But the one thing God gave us, is a heart. Why not use it? Would you look into your heart and send someone to Hell, disregarding the bible, just because they are gay? Probably not. Why does the bible have so much more meaning to life than the heart? I don't get it.
Does the person I work with make them any better than me? Does his/her lifestyle make me any different from the person down the street? What is the point of life if we are all supposed to act and live the same way. Where's the freedom, the free will? Are we supposed to be prisoners held under that bible? Shouldn't we just be robots with no free will then? If we can't stick up for what we believe in, especially the heart, what was God's intention in life then? Was his plan really set up so we're all prisoners at his will and do what says?
I thought we were supposed to be a big family, a big DIVERSE family. Look up that term if you don't know what Diversity means. If we don't have diversity, where is the joy in life? If we never experienced other lifestyles or different things from our life, who could say they learned things from a different part of the community? It's life changing when you see someone dying, but by miracles, they happen to come back up from their flatline. Wouldn't you say so? If your friend was about to die, but somehow managed to live when it was almost impossible for them to stay alive?
Until that day happens, people of all religions and lifestyles, don't take life granted. It's little things like that that changes people and how they perceive the world.
Yes the bible is God's words, but does it really mean it's TRUE and that it's God's point of view until end of time? Weren't black people slaves at one point in time? Never had the rights to do anything? Couldn't do the same things as whites. But because Martin Luther King, who stood up for himself and his community, it took that much just for people to finally see what life is all about. But of course their will always be racists, but life is set up like that.
Do the Ten Commandments mean anything to all of you guys? Does being gay even be simplified at all in them? I don't think so, but yet, we all agree that the Ten Commandments were supposed to be taken literally in all context of time and that is the basics of life. You have to live by them right? Right.
But the bible is more of a biography. More of thoughts. Think about it. If you read the bible, it's about the big and little things back then. About the beginning of time. It's like a journal. Of course, back then, God would say that about homosexuality when life was just beginning and we were not population ourselves. So instead he made the Ten Commandments, that we were supposed to take to heart, to our grave for any generation. Being gay isn't part of that though. But we all agree on that it is the facts of life right?
So why does God's thoughts have so much more meaning than the actual Ten Commandments of life? Obviously if I wrote a biography or a bible RIGHT NOW I would include things that I didn't agree on like how "drugs" and "alcoholics" are taking over the teen community and how I "think" it's not the right way. But, disregarding those behaviors of teenagers, I would take in that it's just a sin that's been created and hate the sin, not the person.
None of you can say whether the bible IS FACT or NOT. You sit here and act like God spoke to you, physically and told you that the what's included in the bible will be taking literally in all times of ages. None of you can prove that. None. So why are you all so "strong" about your valid arguement. Where's your proof?
Have any of you taking a "Logic" class? I have. Got an A. Ohhhh, but I'm dumb right? DUMB! An "A" in LOGIC though. A class about ARGUING and DEBATING. A class most people seemed to struggle in but I went through with a breeze. But I'm dumb right?
To have a valid arguement, you need the most important thing of all. Proof. I'm not saying I have proof. The only proof I have is "MY HEART" and that is enough to figure out the meaning of life. Is it the answer to life? Maybe. But it's enough to figure out what life is all about or get a step forward in life.
You guys believing in the bible and not God physically speaking to you have a invalid arguement. That's like me saying something is true out of a "Harry Potter" book.
Until God speaks to you, you need to DROP the invalid arguement. I have my proof for my VALID arguement and that's my heart. When I say, for instance for you SLOWWWW people, that I'm in love, I can look into my heart and say yes, I'm in love. But you guys go to a book for advice on if you love someone or not?
Go take a Logic class. Learn something. I got an "A" when most people in that class STRUGGLED and received bad grades. I would just love to see these Logic students who passed with "A's" take their viewpoint on this debate. See what they would say. I believe they would agree with me
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Member Since: 10/21/2005
Posts: 19,258
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Quote:
Originally posted by DrogoBrush
I'm sorry, but how many of you are republicans? If so I'm thinking you are taking a political stance to this not religious. I only say this because I know many Christians who think there is nothing wrong with being gay.
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Exactly. In my 24 page novel I just posted, lmfao, I said my Aunt who is my Mom's sister, is a huge huge and I mean huge relgious nut. She is a Christian, but she and her family are nuts. She has a lot of Jesus paintings on her wall and she goes to Church all the time. She has a huge relationship with God at Church.
Yet, she doesn't hate gays, nor does she believe they are sinning. She knows gay people and she doesn't think gay people will go to Hell. <3
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Member Since: 5/5/2009
Posts: 4,479
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Member Since: 7/14/2009
Posts: 22,692
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Your joking right. It's funny, cause I was told a church 'As long as you believe in god, you are a Christian.'
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Member Since: 5/21/2009
Posts: 11,151
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These novels....
Anyways, I never said that Christians were supposed to hate gays. You're talking out of your ass and putting words in my mouth that I have never said. Trying to twist my points is only failing, so please abort that.
I NEVER said being gay was choice. God does NOT make people gay, for the last time. People are gay because of sin. Satan has screwed up people to have perverse attractions to the same sex. Why would God create people gay and then say you're not supposed to be gay?
You're a 23 year old trying to convince himself, rather than anyone else here than anyone else that your sexuality is ok, yet you want to tell me you're far in life?
Times have changed, yes. But the rules don't. When God gives doctrines, they are written in stone forever. You are trying to convince me that God has changed his mind about gays and that he thinks its ok now? You yourself said it was wrong back then, but what evidence to you have to prove that it is ok now? It doesn't work that way. There is no last minute changes or re-editing. You have no evidence whatsoever to even prove yourself that your point is valid, so why are you even arguing it.
We are discussing one God. You can't form God the way you want him to fit your homosexual desires, which you are doing. You need to stop this whole "having a heart" nonsense, because it is completely irrelevant to anything. We're talking factual information here, are we not?
The Bible is not a biography. It is God's word documented by the Apostles, in which we use for our lives.
And you mentioned that God thinks that its ok to be gay now, because the world is overpopulated. YOU TELL ME, What DOCTRINE says that it is now ok to be gay? You are now putting words in God's mouth, which is blasphemy.
The argument you pose about your so-called "good heart" is invalid and you have nothing to prove your point. You can continue to write your own rules and doctrines, but that will not save you, sir.
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Member Since: 7/14/2009
Posts: 22,692
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Quote:
Originally posted by NE.
These novels....
Anyways, I never said that Christians were supposed to hate gays. You're talking out of your ass and putting words in my mouth that I have never said. Trying to twist my points is only failing, so please abort that.
I NEVER said being gay was choice. God does NOT make people gay, for the last time. People are gay because of sin. Satan has screwed up people to have perverse attractions to the same sex. Why would God create people gay and then say you're not supposed to be gay?
You're a 23 year old trying to convince himself, rather than anyone else here than anyone else that your sexuality is ok, yet you want to tell me you're far in life?
Times have changed, yes. But the rules don't. When God gives doctrines, they are written in stone forever. You are trying to convince me that God has changed his mind about gays and that he thinks its ok now? You yourself said it was wrong back then, but what evidence to you have to prove that it is ok now? It doesn't work that way. There is no last minute changes or re-editing. You have no evidence whatsoever to even prove yourself that your point is valid, so why are you even arguing it.
We are discussing one God. You can't form God the way you want him to fit your homosexual desires, which you are doing. You need to stop this whole "having a heart" nonsense, because it is completely irrelevant to anything. We're talking factual information here, are we not?
The Bible is not a biography. It is God's word documented by the Apostles, in which we use for our lives.
And you mentioned that God thinks that its ok to be gay now, because the world is overpopulated. YOU TELL ME, What DOCTRINE says that it is now ok to be gay? You are now putting words in God's mouth, which is blasphemy.
The argument you pose about your so-called "good heart" is invalid and you have nothing to prove your point. You can continue to write your own rules and doctrines, but that will not save you, sir.
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I'm sorry, but everything you just said made no sense to me.
First of all God created EVERYTHING. So he did make gay people gay.
Second, the bible was written by human hand so it is bound to be flawed.
Third, if you go by the Ten Commandments everyone in the world is damned to hell, becasue nobody and I mean no body has been truthful their whole lives. And if you say you have, you are lying.
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Member Since: 10/21/2005
Posts: 19,258
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Oh glory hell no. I give up on you. May God bless you.
You have no significant proof of God. Only the bible and what people TOLD YOU TO BELIEVE. That is an invalid argument. Stop trying to take down an "A" student in Logic. I know the difference between an Invalid argument vs. a valid argument.
Has God spoke to you PHYSICALLLY that Gay people are going to Hell?
Until you do, come back to me. That is your only way to have a VALID argument.
Mine is my heart. When I say I'm in love with a guy, I can rip my heart out and show someone it. What can you do to show your "belief" in the bible? Say you "believe" in God. Again, using the term "Believe" makes it an Invalid argument already.
Would you say you believe in Brtiney Spears for instance? No. You have PHYSICAL proof of her existance. To make your Christian's viewpoints stronger, a more valid viewpoint, don't say you believe in God, say he is my best friend.
But again, you have no proof of his words! So stop messing with a college student. My teacher thought I was pretty smart.
Lastly, why would I want to go to a bible for advice on who I love? I can just look into my heart. Why should I go to a piece of paper with words on it, whether or not to fall in love with someone. Stop with your invalid arguments and ignorance. You won't get anywhere in life.
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Member Since: 4/13/2007
Posts: 2,018
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Quote:
Originally posted by NE.
These novels....
Anyways, I never said that Christians were supposed to hate gays. You're talking out of your ass and putting words in my mouth that I have never said. Trying to twist my points is only failing, so please abort that.
I NEVER said being gay was choice. God does NOT make people gay, for the last time. People are gay because of sin. Satan has screwed up people to have perverse attractions to the same sex. Why would God create people gay and then say you're not supposed to be gay?
You're a 23 year old trying to convince himself, rather than anyone else here than anyone else that your sexuality is ok, yet you want to tell me you're far in life?
Times have changed, yes. But the rules don't. When God gives doctrines, they are written in stone forever. You are trying to convince me that God has changed his mind about gays and that he thinks its ok now? You yourself said it was wrong back then, but what evidence to you have to prove that it is ok now? It doesn't work that way. There is no last minute changes or re-editing. You have no evidence whatsoever to even prove yourself that your point is valid, so why are you even arguing it.
We are discussing one God. You can't form God the way you want him to fit your homosexual desires, which you are doing. You need to stop this whole "having a heart" nonsense, because it is completely irrelevant to anything. We're talking factual information here, are we not?
The Bible is not a biography. It is God's word documented by the Apostles, in which we use for our lives.
And you mentioned that God thinks that its ok to be gay now, because the world is overpopulated. YOU TELL ME, What DOCTRINE says that it is now ok to be gay? You are now putting words in God's mouth, which is blasphemy.
The argument you pose about your so-called "good heart" is invalid and you have nothing to prove your point. You can continue to write your own rules and doctrines, but that will not save you, sir.
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yet you are also writing these "novels"
The bible also says that people who committed adultery should be stoned to death, and even in the bible, it actually promotes slavery and actually tells us how to obtain them, how much you can beat them, and that it is okay to have sex with the female slaves, yet now, in the Church, those are considered as bad.
The bible is in some ways a reflection of that time. Some of the things mentioned in the bible were practices that were done during that time, not now. Here are some passages
In fact, the Bible accepts sexual practices that we condemn and condemns sexual practices that we accept. Lots of them! Here are a few examples.
* DEUTERONOMY 22:13-21
If it is discovered that a bride is not a virgin, the Bible demands that she be executed by stoning immediately.
* DEUTERONOMY 22:22
If a married person has sex with someone else's husband or wife, the Bible commands that both adulterers be stoned to death.
* MARK 10:1-12
Divorce is strictly forbidden in both Testaments, as is remarriage of anyone who has been divorced.
* LEVITICUS 18:19
The Bible forbids a married couple from having sexual intercourse during a woman's period. If they disobey, both shall be executed.
* MARK 12:18-27
If a man dies childless, his widow is ordered by biblical law to have intercourse with each of his brothers in turn until she bears her deceased husband a male heir.
* DEUTERONOMY 25:11-12
If a man gets into a fight with another man and his wife seeks to rescue her husband by grabbing the enemy's genitals, her hand shall be cut off and no pity shall be shown her.
Obviously, most of today's society would see all of this as bad even though this can be found in the Bible. I see the Bible as a book about God, not a book about human sexuality.
And to Departure, you need to learn not to try to shove these ideas down people's throat. You at times can be just as worse as the people you are arguing against. You seem to think that everything has to be gay in order for things to be normal.
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Member Since: 5/21/2009
Posts: 11,151
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Quote:
Originally posted by DrogoBrush
I'm sorry, but everything you just said made no sense to me.
First of all God created EVERYTHING. So he did make gay people gay.
Second, the bible was written by human hand so it is bound to be flawed.
Third, if you go by the Ten Commandments everyone in the world is damned to hell, becasue nobody and I mean no body has been truthful their whole lives. And if you say you have, you are lying.
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No. God made people, but he did not make them gay.
The Apostles who wrote the Bible recieved divine word from God. God wrote the Bible through the Apostles.
We are damned to hell, because of sin, but we can overcome that.
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Member Since: 10/21/2005
Posts: 19,258
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and lmfao @ NE saying I have no valid proof of me loving someone. Don't we all love from the heart?? DEATH!
So what NE your saying when we fall in love with someone, it's really from the bible not the heart? What is the signifance of the heart then? I thought we all loved from the heart?
And NO NO NO, I'm not trying to shove anything down people's throats. I just don't get how people can hate upon love. And I want the same rights as everyone else. Your not gay so shush. When people like NE saying this and that about homosexuality, I"m supposed to be "ok" with it? Knowing I'm gay myself?
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Member Since: 5/21/2009
Posts: 11,151
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Quote:
Originally posted by Departure
Oh glory hell no. I give up on you. May God bless you.
You have no significant proof of God. Only the bible and what people TOLD YOU TO BELIEVE. That is an invalid argument. Stop trying to take down an "A" student in Logic. I know the difference between an Invalid argument vs. a valid argument.
Has God spoke to you PHYSICALLLY that Gay people are going to Hell?
Until you do, come back to me. That is your only way to have a VALID argument.
Mine is my heart. When I say I'm in love with a guy, I can rip my heart out and show someone it. What can you do to show your "belief" in the bible? Say you "believe" in God. Again, using the term "Believe" makes it an Invalid argument already.
Would you say you believe in Brtiney Spears for instance? No. You have PHYSICAL proof of her existance. To make your Christian's viewpoints stronger, a more valid viewpoint, don't say you believe in God, say he is my best friend.
But again, you have no proof of his words! So stop messing with a college student. My teacher thought I was pretty smart.
Lastly, why would I want to go to a bible for advice on who I love? I can just look into my heart. Why should I go to a piece of paper with words on it, whether or not to fall in love with someone. Stop with your invalid arguments and ignorance. You won't get anywhere in life.
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"A" student in logic? Well you sure don't use this so-called "logic" very often. You have no clue of what a valid argument is, because you are trying to base your argument off of your own desires, which is completely irrelevant.
No, I haven't spoken directly to God, neither have you. Has he told you that gay people AREN'T going to hell?
The Bible says so.
You want to call my argument invalid, because I base mine of faith, yet you are basing yours off of your own selfish desires. Do you have PHYSICAL proof that being gay isn't a sin?
No. You don't,
But I do.
Why not look into the Bible for advice on love, you ask? Because the Bible gives us the truth.
The thing is Kevin, You looking into "your heart" is only giving you lies and lust, because you want to fufill your own selfish desires rather than listening to the truth, and you believe that is going to take you to heaven? You're in for a rude awakening, sir.
Face the facts.
You want to tell me I wont get anywhere in life, yet you are a 23-year old male insecure with his salvation, looking for assurance from an online forum? Oh I see.
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Member Since: 5/21/2009
Posts: 11,151
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Quote:
Originally posted by Departure
and lmfao @ NE saying I have no valid proof of me loving someone. Don't we all love from the heart?? DEATH!
So what NE your saying when we fall in love with someone, it's really from the bible not the heart? What is the signifance of the heart then? I thought we all loved from the heart?
And NO NO NO, I'm not trying to shove anything down people's throats. I just don't get how people can hate upon love. And I want the same rights as everyone else. Your not gay so shush. When people like NE saying this and that about homosexuality, I"m supposed to be "ok" with it? Knowing I'm gay myself?
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Nobody is hating upon love. We are simply stating facts. And the fact that you are neglecting biblical resource makes any point of your completely irrelevant.
Believe what you want, Kevin. But remember that it's not going to save you.
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Member Since: 10/21/2005
Posts: 19,258
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ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL *DEATHHHHH* I'm dead. LIterally. You killed every good in my soul NE. I don't know if you are being an ignorant asshole on purpose just to get me riled or you are in fact serious.
ROFL.
Ok, so when I fell in love with this guy I blabbed about in that other thread, I felt something in my heart from sin? LMFAO!!!!
You crack me up NE. I'm starting to think this is just a funny joke to you and your not be serious. My valid argument is not based on my desires. I'm using common sense. When your in love you feel from the heart. END OF STORY.
And I felt that with a guy. Not a girl. END OF STORY.
You, like I stated, have no proof of God. Just the bible. And why do I need to make a valid argument about the phrase "No man shall lie with another man, as with a woman." from the bible when my valid argument is from the heart?
I love how you Christian's feel it's ok to tear down the GBLT community and keep your faith upon this God.
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Member Since: 5/5/2009
Posts: 4,479
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Quote:
Originally posted by DrogoBrush
Your joking right. It's funny, cause I was told a church 'As long as you believe in god, you are a Christian.'
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if you don't believe in God's Word you aren't a Christian.
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Member Since: 4/13/2007
Posts: 2,018
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Member Since: 7/14/2009
Posts: 22,692
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Quote:
Originally posted by NE.
Nobody is hating upon love.
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BULL ****!!!
By saying love someone of you gender is bad, you are hating love. Religion and Love are two different things and should NEVER be use together.
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Member Since: 7/14/2009
Posts: 22,692
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ashley's Fool
was my post neglected???
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I read it and you made good points.
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Member Since: 10/21/2005
Posts: 19,258
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ashley's Fool
was my post neglected???
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Of course. Ignorant Christian's like NE like to avoid those "facts" about life that was "set in stone" such long time ago that can't "change" through many "generations" when we will have flying cars in the future.
And I noted your post in my last novel lol!
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