[that G.U.Y.]

Omg my president gives the best speeches. So glad I voted for talent

[RihRihGirrrl]

Originally posted by Lord Blackout

I don't think NAFTA played much of a role as it created as many jobs as it lost. After all, she had the white working class in 2008 and that was when America was losing 800,000 jobs a month.

TPP though...

I beg to differ. For the working class, this election was very much about jobs being shipped overseas and they have seen their jobs be squeezed for decades now. With Bernie and Trump in this election they made trade a central part of their campaign and essentially scapegoated 'bad trade deals' as the reason why the middle class has suffered. I dnt agree because I think that trade is necessary and it has done more good than harm for our economy but for those folks, it is the reason for their economic hardships. And these folks were against TPP because they believe their jobs have have been gutted by NAFTA. That's the source of their anger and for the first time, you had 2 major candidates with a populist message, playing to the anxiety of white working class voters by beating the trade issue to death. They haven't felt the impact of TPP but they have been impacted by NAFTA so Hillary had no way of distancing herself from the trade issue.

[Espresso]

Why am I always busy when this thread blows up

Anyways, decorum as I expected from the president elect but the Reagan line was priceless

Measured speech but I can understand how a lot of Hillary supporters would be pissed he wasn't more forceful

[Lord Blackout]

Originally posted by RihRihGirrrl

I beg to differ. For the working class, this election was very much about jobs being shipped overseas and they have seen their jobs be squeezed for decades now. With Bernie and Trump in this election they made trade a central part of their campaign and essentially scapegoated 'bad trade deals' as the reason why the middle class has suffered. I dnt agree because I think that trade is necessary and it has done more good than harm for our economy but for those folks, it is the reason for their economic hardships. And these folks were against TPP because they believe their jobs have have been gutted by NAFTA. That's the source of their anger and for the first time, you had 2 major candidates with a populist message, playing to the anxiety of white working class voters by beating the trade issue to death. They haven't felt the impact of TPP but they have been impacted by NAFTA so Hillary had no way of distancing herself from the trade issue.

That's what I'm saying. They were fearing TPP far more than they were angry at NAFTA. TPP was a big threat on their livelihoods.

[RihRihGirrrl]

Originally posted by Lord Blackout

That's what I'm saying. They were fearing TPP far more than they were angry at NAFTA. TPP was a big threat on their livelihoods.

But why did they fear TPP? Because of NAFTA

My point is that no matter what, she was going to be labeled as the establishment candidate that was partly responsible for bad trade deals because NAFTA was passed by her husband. Thus, the working class was only going to be in jeopardy because of Trump and Bernie's populist message.

[RihRihGirrrl]

Not to mention Hillary supported the TPP before she was against it, calling it the gold standard

[Lord Blackout]

Originally posted by RihRihGirrrl

But why did they fear TPP? Because of NAFTA

My point is that no matter what, she was going to be labeled as the establishment candidate that was partly responsible for bad trade deals because NAFTA was passed by her husband. Thus, the working class was only going to be in jeopardy because of Trump and Bernie's populist message.

That's what I'm saying. They feared TPP and based that fear on NAFTA's consequences on their likes. Her TPP praise when it was just a fetus made her the TPP candidate even though she was against it.

It's amazing how many factors would have altered the election results if only ONE of them didn't exist because Trump's margins were so razor thin and he lost the pop vote by big numbers.

[RihRihGirrrl]

Originally posted by Lord Blackout

That's what I'm saying. They feared TPP and based that fear on NAFTA's consequences on their likes. Her TPP praise when it was just a fetus made her the TPP candidate even though she was against it.

It's amazing how many factors would have altered the election results if only ONE of them didn't exist because Trump's margins were so razor thin and he lost the pop vote by big numbers.

Ok gotcha. My original point was that distancing herself from Obama wouldn't have helped because what hurt her with the white working class was primarily the trade issue and there was no real way to distance herself from TPP or NAFTA

[RihRihGirrrl]

I still think ultimately what did her in was the Comey debacle..,,it was that last bit of doubt that the undecided voters needed to break away from her in the final days of the campaign

[Lord Blackout]

Originally posted by RihRihGirrrl

I still think ultimately what did her in was the Comey debacle..,,it was that last bit of doubt that the undecided voters needed to break away from her in the final days of the campaign

Yes, that was the newest factor which is why it got blamed the most. It doesn't mean the other factors aren't as responsible.

[that G.U.Y.]

She apologized way too late when it came to the emails.

It was a serious thing and she tried to gloss over it. By the time she gave an appropriate apology most people had made up their minds

[Lord Blackout]

Hillary Clinton is at 65,844,594 votes, just 71k shy of the 65,915,795 Obama won in 2012. But she won 100 fewer electoral votes.
https://twitter.com/redistrict/statu...16754331836416

It's coming

[Lose My Breath]

Originally posted by Lord Blackout

Yes, that was the newest factor which is why it got blamed the most. It doesn't mean the other factors aren't as responsible.

True, but the Comey situation was the final nail in the coffin

[Lord Blackout]

I did NOT expect them to stay together following her loss

[King Maxx]

I don't why you think their relationship was fake.

No woman as strong as her stays with a man who did her dirty. Bill did more to hurt her image than help. THAT'S LOVE!

[Lord Blackout]

Sorry, I spent my whole life thinking they're a two-bedroom couple that's only together to get back to the white house.

Guess my whole life is a lie.

[Lord Blackout]

Think of a universe where Paul Ryan is POTUS and Justin Trudeau is still Canada PM

[King Maxx]

Originally posted by Redstreak

We constantly drone bomb countless innocents in a variety of Middle Eastern nations while our military budget is bigger than any other nation by leagues. We invaded Iraq on false pretenses and we're militarily involved in more countries with Obama leaving than when he entered. How on God's soon to be not green earth can we possibly go more to the right besides full out unprovoked nuclear war?

The country doesn't need to move more to the right. It does need to be smart though.

But the liberals and their utopian view where we all get along isn't a possibility right now. We need to be the strongest military and power in the world. Not becoming non-interventionist. It's ridiculous.

It's so bad that they don't even want to fight ISIS because of civilians. We have to fight. War has casualties. (Not saying that what is happening in Syria is sane or acceptable)

[midnightdawn]

Originally posted by that G.U.Y.

She apologized way too late when it came to the emails.

It was a serious thing and she tried to gloss over it. By the time she gave an appropriate apology most people had made up their minds

This is the big problem with her. By late 2015 Democrats were getting so frustrated because she wouldn't acknowledge her wrong doing, and made jokes like "Did I wipe it with a cloth?". It cost her so much in the polls. Nearly every other politician basically says to their advisers "What can I do to make this scandal go away?". But she always does the exact opposite and makes it worse.

[King Maxx]

How do you make a non-scandal go away though?

People didn't want it to go away because they already hated her so they used that to justify it.