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Poll: Which gender has more freedom of expression?
View Poll Results: Who has more freedom of expression in western society?
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Men
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57 |
39.86% |
Women
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73 |
51.05% |
It's about equal
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13 |
9.09% |
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 6,630
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Quote:
Originally posted by Repo
1. The poll is about gender expressionism, not who has political power in what countries. They are objectively different things
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The answer is still men. Literally everywhere in the world, not just the middle east.
The fact that some of you think that men being afraid to show their emotions is worse than what women go through...
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Member Since: 9/4/2011
Posts: 29,960
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It clearly says in the poll "Who has more freedom of expression in western society?"
Quote:
Originally posted by Heroine
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A good amount of this only applies to the middle east. The rest aren't really about expression.
1. Ok, though c'mon, this is very exceptional.
4. Ok.
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 8,579
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Quote:
Originally posted by Nano
The answer is still men. Literally everywhere in the world, not just the middle east.
The fact that some of you think that men being afraid to show their emotions is worse than what women go through...
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And how is women gender expressionism being so much more oppressed by a large margin in a country like the U.S., where men cannot show emotions (which as I explained, is incredibly unhealthy), are expected to dress a very specific way (and cannot take from any women's fashions, whereas women can take from men's fashions), are expected to listen to specific kinds of music (no pop music allowed, really), expected to act in a very specific way, are expected to NOT be virginal (and are assumed to always be eager to hook up if they can), etc.
I want examples. Don't state something and expect me to agree because you stated it, give me some logic behind it.
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Member Since: 1/2/2011
Posts: 3,257
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gender roles is the devil.
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Member Since: 6/28/2010
Posts: 7,399
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kim Kardashian
Women, definitely.
Men also have it hard too though. I know a lot of people on here (presumably including the OP) believe feminists disregard this when anyone will a brain cell or two will understand 'toxic masculinity'.
Gender roles hurt everyone and the sooner everyone accepts this and starts giving a **** about equal rights, the quicker we'll get past it. Most of ATRL are self-hating fem guys because they've been conditioned by society to feel that way about themselves.
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In the western world, men and women do have equal rights.
And I don't believe all feminists disregard that men can have it hard as well, however many feminists would rather talk about statistics and contriving parity of gender in professions rather than actually examining the gender roles which we both agree are so harmful and restrictive. I'm not talking about all feminists though.
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Member Since: 4/14/2011
Posts: 48,397
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Wait what the **** I was reading that BuzzFeed article which clearly proves how men are at an advantage and
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According to Women Under Siege, “many nations still have rape-marriage policies that force the survivor to marry her perpetrator in effect. These include Venezuela in Latin America, Indonesia in Asia, Cameroon and Chad in Africa, and Denmark and Russia in Europe.
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This can't be real for Denmark I barely believe it for Venezuela and Russia, but Denmark?
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 8,579
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Quote:
Originally posted by brndksk
In the western world, men and women do have equal rights.
And I don't believe all feminists disregard that men can have it hard as well, however many feminists would rather talk about statistics and contriving parity of gender in professions rather than actually examining the gender roles which we both agree are so harmful and restrictive. I'm not talking about all feminists though.
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Agreed
Quote:
Originally posted by LoKoPaNdA
Wait what the **** I was reading that BuzzFeed article which clearly proves how men are at an advantage and
This can't be real for Denmark I barely believe it for Venezuela and Russia, but Denmark?
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While that's OBVIOUSLY worse than anything men have in the U.S....., it technically isn't gender expressionism whih is what this thread is about (Rights are obviously a more serious issue, but so is gender expressionism/gender roles). Plus, the topic itslef seems very concentrated on countries like the U.S. or UK where both genders have equal rights
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Banned
Member Since: 8/6/2015
Posts: 89
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Men.
Women have a wider range of expression at their disposal, but I can't regard it as "freedom of expression" when the limits of their actions are dictated and governed by men. Men still occupy the upper role in our gender hierarchy; the argument that they can't express their emotions the same way women can is ********.
Once men deem it acceptable for themselves to behave like women, that will be the status quo. However women are not in the same position to establish how they are perceived and treated in society.
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 16,870
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Quote:
Originally posted by Nano
The answer is still men. Literally everywhere in the world, not just the middle east.
The fact that some of you think that men being afraid to show their emotions is worse than what women go through...
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This
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Member Since: 6/28/2010
Posts: 7,399
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Quote:
Originally posted by Artemisia
women today have absolutely no political power in some nations but heyyyyyyyy at least they can wear pink and not get called a ***
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But this isn't about political power, and this isn't about 'some nations', it's about the western world.
And don't you think it's a little bit offensive to - supposedly as a feminist - belittle the issue of self-expression and gender roles, especially when these arguments used to apply to women far more than men??
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 8,579
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Quote:
Originally posted by Honeymoon
Men.
Women have a wider range of expression at their disposal, but I can't regard it as "freedom of expression" when the limits of their actions are dictated and governed by men. Men still occupy the upper role in our gender hierarchy; the argument that they can't express their emotions the same way women can is ********.
Once men deem it acceptable for themselves to behave like women, that will be the status quo. However women are not in the same position to establish how they are perceived and treated in society.
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The government has no power over gender expressionism in the U.S. due to thinks like the first amendment, and both genders play a part in determining what is considered acceptable/unacceptable gender behavior. YOur logic is ridiculous and inaccurate.
Quote:
Originally posted by that G.U.Y.
This
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Examples. I want them. Now.
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Member Since: 9/4/2011
Posts: 29,960
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Quote:
Originally posted by Nano
The answer is still men. Literally everywhere in the world, not just the middle east.
The fact that some of you think that men being afraid to show their emotions is worse than what women go through...
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Like omg. We're comparing men's freedom of expression to women's freedom of expression, NOT men's freedom of expression to women's oppression.
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Member Since: 6/28/2010
Posts: 7,399
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Quote:
Originally posted by Honeymoon
Men.
Women have a wider range of expression at their disposal, but I can't regard it as "freedom of expression" when the limits of their actions are dictated and governed by men. Men still occupy the upper role in our gender hierarchy; the argument that they can't express their emotions the same way women can is ********.
Once men deem it acceptable for themselves to behave like women, that will be the status quo. However women are not in the same position to establish how they are perceived and treated in society.
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Like it or not, we are living in a society where women and men are leading very different lifestyles, and making very different decisions about the way in which they pursue their careers and their happiness. Whether this is because of gender roles or biology or both, that's up for discussion and it's an important debate to have.
Your argument also seems to misunderstand the fact that in the west we live in a representative democracy where each elected representative serves all the people... and in the majority of western democracies the majority of voters are actually women. But anyhow this isn't related to the OP...
Personally I believe it ultimately all comes down to gender roles.
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 6,630
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Quote:
Originally posted by Repo
And how is women gender expressionism being so much more oppressed by a large margin in a country like the U.S., where men cannot show emotions (which as I explained, is incredibly unhealthy), are expected to dress a very specific way (and cannot take from any women's fashions, whereas women can take from men's fashions), are expected to listen to specific kinds of music (no pop music allowed, really), expected to act in a very specific way, are expected to NOT be virginal (and are assumed to always be eager to hook up if they can), etc.
I want examples. Don't state something and expect me to agree because you stated it, give me some logic behind it.
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Men aren't allowed to be sad. Meanwhile, men hate it when women are angry and will frequently call them names because of it or tell them to "shut up". Women who like rock music will get a lot of hate for it, since some men will think they're "posers" or "fakes". Women are also under a lot of pressure to not be promiscuous, and will often be shunned by family members or classmates if they are.
Also, did you hear of a recent thing called "Gamergate"? If you didn't, I suggest you read up on it.
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Member Since: 9/1/2012
Posts: 25,973
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Women have more freedom of expression (in many ways), but they also experience more prejudice because of it.
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 16,870
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Quote:
Examples. I want them. Now.
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One example is a woman who gets slapped by her husband because she said something he didnt like. He can say whatever he wants to her, but she must carefully choose her words and tone lest she upset him.
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Member Since: 6/28/2010
Posts: 7,399
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Quote:
Originally posted by Repo
No one suggested that. And thinking about it, this poll is actually pretty ineffective since gender expressionism abilities are very different dependent on society (in the middle east, men OBVIOUSLY have more)
That said, in the U.S., women do have more gender expressionism than men do.
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I said in western society.
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Member Since: 4/14/2011
Posts: 48,397
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Quote:
Originally posted by Repo
Agreed
While that's OBVIOUSLY worse than anything men have in the U.S....., it technically isn't gender expressionism whih is what this thread is about (Rights are obviously a more serious issue, but so is gender expressionism/gender roles). Plus, the topic itslef seems very concentrated on countries like the U.S. or UK where both genders have equal rights
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If you read the article itself you'll see that women have it rough when it comes to 'gender expression'--from what they wear to how they carry themselves, they are judged more harshly. Supposedly equality has been achieved in the West but lots of things remain to be done, just because it says in the law that men and women are equal doesn't mean it corresponds with the reality
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Member Since: 6/19/2012
Posts: 29,579
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you aren't allowed to ignore the majority of women on the planet and focus the discussion on your cushy western nations where women supposedly have equal rights (they don't really).
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Member Since: 6/28/2010
Posts: 7,399
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Quote:
Originally posted by that G.U.Y.
One example is a woman who gets slapped by her husband because she said something he didnt like. He can say whatever he wants to her, but she must carefully choose her words and tone lest she upset him.
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No-one is denying that some women are in terrible situations, but the typical feminist response to this nowadays is to focus entirely on the woman... this won't solve the problem. We need to examine our gender and gender roles and determine why so many men are like this.
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