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Poll: Should trans-teen be able to use girl's lockerroom?
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View Poll Results: I think that
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Yes, she identifies as a girl
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165 |
63.46% |
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No, she still has a penis and should use the uni-sex bathroom
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95 |
36.54% |
Member Since: 9/1/2013
Posts: 5,014
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Can't believe this thread is still going on 
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Member Since: 2/5/2014
Posts: 1,395
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Are there even any trans users on this site?
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Member Since: 8/3/2010
Posts: 71,871
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Quote:
Originally posted by Antonini
Are there even any trans users on this site?
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Multiple. I believe Giselle is one
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ATRL Contributor
Member Since: 5/28/2011
Posts: 39,615
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Quote:
Originally posted by Marvin
Yeah, she's being selfish tbh. She needs to understand where other people are coming from as well.
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But literally NO ONE who says this is understanding where SHE is coming from.
Stop this "Other people need their respect, too!" nonsense.
While it's true, it's not applicable to this situation because cisgendered people (people who aren't trans) get their way EVERY single day in situations like this, and trans people get nothing but disrespect.
Stop it.
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ATRL Contributor
Member Since: 5/28/2011
Posts: 39,615
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Why is it so ****ing hard for you lot to just respect someone's gender identity?
They're not attacking you by asking to be referred to as her/she/etc., and they're not attacking you by asking to use the bathroom or changing room they feel is fit for their gender. You're attacking them for saying all of that is wrong.
End of.
Quote:
Originally posted by KyIe
Just because she identifies as female means NOTHING to me. Her biological SEX is male until gender reassignment surgery is completed. Until then, she cannot use the biological sex driven FEMALE locker room when she doesn't not share the same sexual organs FEMALES do. This has nothing to do with whether she identifies as a man of a woman. Yes she is mentally female but how does mentally correlate to biological sex organs? It doesn't. Not allowing somebody who isn't a female to use the female restroom isn't discriminatory not matter what you may believe.
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You don't understand trans identity at all.
She is a woman stuck in the body of a man.
She identifies as a woman, and that's that.
It literally does NOT matter what her genitalia or body says; if she identifies as a woman, then she is a woman, and that's that.
Saying she's a man because she's still stuck in a male body is insulting. She hasn't reached a point where she can get sexual reassignment surgery, because it takes years to build up to that point and it costs a lot of money.
Stop the ignorance.
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Member Since: 8/7/2015
Posts: 801
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Quote:
Originally posted by X/O/X/O
Why is it so ****ing hard for you lot to just respect someone's gender identity?
They're not attacking you by asking to be referred to as her/she/etc., and they're not attacking you by asking to use the bathroom or changing room they feel is fit for their gender. You're attacking them for saying all of that is wrong.
End of.
You don't understand trans identity at all.
She is a woman stuck in the body of a man.
She identifies as a woman, and that's that.
It literally does NOT matter what her genitalia or body says; if she identifies as a woman, then she is a woman, and that's that.
Saying she's a man because she's still stuck in a male body is insulting. She hasn't reached a point where she can get sexual reassignment surgery, because it takes years to build up to that point and it costs a lot of money.
Stop the ignorance. |
Gender is not a "concept." It's chromosomal. If you think you're the wrong gender then you are looking at gender the wrong way. A man may like cashmere and nail polish, but that doesn't make him female. I know plenty of women who don't wesr nail polish or high heels or sexy clothes. That doesn't mean that they are less female than a man who cuts off his dick, takes hormones and tries to look like a Playboy bunny.
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Member Since: 8/3/2010
Posts: 71,871
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Quote:
Originally posted by IsaiahFisher
Gender is not a "concept." It's chromosomal. If you think you're the wrong gender then you are looking at gender the wrong way. A man may like cashmere and nail polish, but that doesn't make him female. I know plenty of women who don't wesr nail polish or high heels or sexy clothes. That doesn't mean that they are less female than a man who cuts off his dick, takes hormones and tries to look like a Playboy bunny.
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You're so wrong. First sentence alone is just completely wrong. 
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Member Since: 3/15/2013
Posts: 6,659
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Quote:
Originally posted by Antonini
Are there even any trans users on this site?
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Me.
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ATRL Contributor
Member Since: 5/28/2011
Posts: 39,615
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Quote:
Originally posted by IsaiahFisher
Gender is not a "concept." It's chromosomal. If you think you're the wrong gender then you are looking at gender the wrong way. A man may like cashmere and nail polish, but that doesn't make him female. I know plenty of women who don't wesr nail polish or high heels or sexy clothes. That doesn't mean that they are less female than a man who cuts off his dick, takes hormones and tries to look like a Playboy bunny.
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Gender and sex are not the same thing.
Sex is your physical body.
Gender is your mental perception of yourself. (I could probably word this better)
Look back a couple pages at what Citrus posted. Science (since a couple members here keep liking to bring that up) has proven that gender is a mental concept much more than it is a physical one.
If the person in question identifies as a female, that is all that needs to happen to make them female. How they dress and style themselves doesn't matter, but if wearing a dress and heels is what they feel comfortable in, they should do that.
You're looking at gender the wrong way because you think it's limited to the body. If you hae such a hard time grasping the fact that identifying as a woman is all you need to do to be a woman, then I don't know how you're going to even begin to understand other things like being nonbinary. 
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 5,723
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Quote:
Originally posted by X/O/X/O
Gender and sex are not the same thing.
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No one can argue this so I don't know why people are trying to.
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ATRL Moderator
Member Since: 11/1/2010
Posts: 26,750
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Quote:
Originally posted by IsaiahFisher
Gender is not a "concept." It's chromosomal. If you think you're the wrong gender then you are looking at gender the wrong way. A man may like cashmere and nail polish, but that doesn't make him female. I know plenty of women who don't wesr nail polish or high heels or sexy clothes. That doesn't mean that they are less female than a man who cuts off his dick, takes hormones and tries to look like a Playboy bunny.
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Yea it is. And it's about way more than the superficiality you mentioned.
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Not at all surprised by a few G's completely discrediting and judging all T's
LGBorT.
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Member Since: 8/18/2013
Posts: 40,566
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Quote:
Originally posted by heauxm
Curious to know what ATRL's biological women think? (if we have any  ) would you be okay in sharing the communal shower with her? |
Yes
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 7,726
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ascension
I have discomfort with unisex restrooms for various reasons which is why I feel like trans peoples' rights to use gender specific bathrooms should absolutely be protected as well because they probably feel the same way I do and feel far more comfortable in restrooms with only other people of the same gender. I think unisex restrooms are fine for people that are completely comfortable with such arrangements, but I don't think anyone should be forced into that.
Trans people being forced to use gender specific bathrooms:
^This is far more disruptive, embarrassing and potentially dangerous for some than the alternative of simply allowing people to use bathrooms associated with their identified genders. |
So your point is, since the transman looks like a man he should be able to use the man's bathroom. Well what about a trans-girl that still looks like a man naked? How does she fit in any better in the girls' showers that the man you posted in the picture above?
Use the unisex shower until you have the proper equipment.
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ATRL Contributor
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 15,224
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As long as she isn't perving on the girls (which she's no more likely to do than a lesbian or even curious straight cis-girl), it's fine.
We don't shower at school here though so i'm a little confused. Do y'all get naked to shower at school? Or not have separate stalls? Unless y'all get naked in a communal shower I don't understand why anyone could have a problem with it.
Regardless of all that, the transphobia in this thread is vile. I feel so sorry for that poor girl. Having 200 people walk out over it.
To all y'all saying 'just get the surgery' it's really not that simple. You can just click your fingers and have a vagina. I've never heard of anyone under 18 getting SRS.
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 7,726
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kim Kardashian
As long as she isn't perving on the girls (which she's no more likely to do than a lesbian or even curious straight cis-girl), it's fine.
We don't shower at school here though so i'm a little confused. Do y'all get naked to shower at school? Or not have separate stalls? Unless y'all get naked in a communal shower I don't understand why anyone could have a problem with it.
Regardless of all that, the transphobia in this thread is vile. I feel so sorry for that poor girl. Having 200 people walk out over it.
To all y'all saying 'just get the surgery' it's really not that simple. You can just click your fingers and have a vagina. I've never heard of anyone under 18 getting SRS.
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A lot of lockerrooms have communal showers for after gym class.
The school that Lila goes to, does not have stalls, the girls all have to get dressed in front of each other. Lila, although she identifies as a girl, looks like a boy.
So you understand why teenage girls would be uncomfortable with that?
According to the CNN article. http://edition.cnn.com/2015/09/03/li...der-teen-feat/
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ATRL Contributor
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 15,224
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Quote:
Originally posted by Qwerty1234
A lot of lockerrooms have communal showers for after gym class.
The school that Lila goes to, does not have stalls, the girls all have to get dressed in front of each other. Lila, although she identifies as a girl, looks like a boy.
So you understand why teenage girls would be uncomfortable with that?
According to the CNN article. http://edition.cnn.com/2015/09/03/li...der-teen-feat/ |
Do people get naked in front of each other though? Because as long as Lila keeps her underwear on it's fine. Plus I doubt she'd use the shower anyway even if she does use the lockeroom.
A lot of this is just due to people not understanding and plain transphobia. I would assume Lila's a straight girl. Though that shouldn't matter. Unless she's a straight up pervert (which any cis-girl could be), she's doing no harm.
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Member Since: 9/1/2013
Posts: 22,540
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Quote:
Originally posted by YUNGKALIMXEL
Can't believe this thread is still going on |
Mte
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Member Since: 9/2/2012
Posts: 7,210
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Quote:
Originally posted by heauxm
Curious to know what ATRL's biological women think? (if we have any ) would you be okay in sharing the communal shower with her? |
Would be 100% fine with it. Ive never seen anyone get naked in one anyway
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Member Since: 3/6/2011
Posts: 7,176
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they just should stop with this gender ********. The majority and trans people too. Why is it so important to idenify with a gender? This gender binary view has caused so much problem already (opression, sexism, sexual prejudice). I can't see why gender disctinctions is so important in our society. What benefits do they exactly have? Sexism? Woman's opression? Homophobia? No, thanks.
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Member Since: 12/1/2010
Posts: 23,572
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bathomet
they just should stop with this gender ********. The majority and trans people too. Why is it so important to idenify with a gender? This gender binary view has caused so much problem already (opression, sexism, sexual prejudice). I can't see why gender disctinctions is so important in our society. What benefits do they exactly have? Sexism? Woman's opression? Homophobia? No, thanks.
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It is important. That's like saying 'ethnic culture is ********! We're all one!' No, culture is important just as gender is. I'm not a blank. I identify with my gender because it is part of who I am as an individual. It is more important to get people to understand gender than it is to get rid of it. We should be teaching people to accept differences, not ignore them.
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