[King Maxx]

Originally posted by Marvin

Maybe the dates didn't work for him?

Y'all don't even try

She didn't even want or need a debate, and he cried for one. She gave 3 dates and turned down all. Monday would've worked. Stop. He didn't want her debating b4 Wisconsin because he thinks he's safe. This is EXACTLY what Bernie supporters are bashing her for with New York.

[Marvin]

Originally posted by jpow

I've been thinking about something in particular in this thread that's gotten me really upset since it was posted.



You posted this KNOWING that this propaganda image was false. You and I talked in this thread about a week ago about the National Nurses United for Patient Protection, that raised 2.3 million dollars for Bernie. This image has NOTHING about that. Even if it wouldn't be that bad for Bernie because it's a union, it's still upsetting that you knew this image was false and tried posting it as fact anyway. And when I posted that the Nurses group was missing, you ignored me.

This is a major problem I have with Bernie supporters. They, like their candidate, will say lies to do anything to prove Bernie is better than Hillary.

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/0...per-pac-218478

Or maybe it's just an old image that needs updating? It's from July 2015, and it wasn't false at the time. And yeah, the NNU is still a union so the "Representing People" tag is still accurate. I was posting it because people were trying to act like Bernie's corporate donations are on the same level as Hillary's which is just FALSE.

Mess @ you getting mad over facts. This isn't propaganda

[Marvin]

Originally posted by King Maxx

She didn't even want or need a debate, and he cried for one. She gave 3 dates and turned down all. Monday would've worked. Stop. He didn't want her debating b4 Wisconsin because he thinks he's safe. This is EXACTLY what Bernie supporters are bashing her for with New York.

Monday is too soon anyway. She should've chosen the 11th.

[Marvin]

Monday is the same night as the NCAA Championship game. She knows no one would be watching. Bye

[jpow]

Originally posted by Marvin

Or maybe it's just an old image that needs updating? It's from July 2015, and it wasn't false at the time. And yeah, the NNU is still a union so the "Representing People" tag is still accurate. I was posting it because people were trying to act like Bernie's corporate donations are on the same level as Hillary's which is just FALSE.

Mess @ you getting mad over facts. This isn't propaganda

I'm not mad over the facts. I'm more mad that you knew the image was outdated and still tried it pass it off as current and correct.

[Orpheus]

What dates did Sanders propose, if any?

Smart move for Clinton camp to go on the offensive on this but I have to say the degradation of the democratic side from talking about issues to arguing about these technical nonsensical things is frustrating.

[Marvin]

Originally posted by jpow

I'm not mad over the facts. I'm more mad that you knew the image was outdated and still tried it pass it off as current and correct.

I actually didn't, but either way the premise is the same.

[King Maxx]

She doesn't have to choose anything. They wanted a NY debate. She's giving it to them.

[jpow]

Originally posted by Marvin

I actually didn't, but either way the premise is the same.

The premise is not the same and yes you did. This is a problem with you and countless other Bernie supporters and even Bernie himself. This is why a lot of people have problems with his campaign, and those who don't have this problem are in the age group that are more likely to believe what's told to them versus doing their own research.

[Marvin]

Originally posted by jpow

The premise is not the same and yes you did. This is a problem with you and countless other Bernie supporters and even Bernie himself. This is why a lot of people have problems with his campaign, and those who don't have this problem are in the age group that are more likely to believe what's told to them versus doing their own research.

Yes it is: Hillary's biggest donations come from wealthy corporations and Bernie's come from unions made up of everyday people. Hillary's numbers are outdated in that chart too; do you think she hasn't gotten any large donations this campaign?

I really don't know what the problem is you're referring too. Politifact said it was true, so even if they did just believe it without doing their research, they'd have the correct information.

[Marvin]

Sanders Campaign Statement on New York Debate

“We are very pleased that Secretary Clinton finally has accepted our request for a debate about the needs of New York and America. Unfortunately, the dates and venues she has proposed don’t make a whole lot of sense. The idea that they want a debate in New York on a night of the NCAA finals – with Syracuse in the tournament no less – is ludicrous. We have proposed other dates which they have rejected. We hope we can reach agreement in the near future. The people of New York and America deserve to see and hear a debate on the important issues facing the state and country.”

[geo]

If the Sanders campaign comes up with a legitimate reason why the April 14 date is so awful then maybe the Clinton campaign will be willing to compromise. Unfortunately Bernie still needs to learn he can not control every single detail of the primaries, maybe he needs to compromise a little too.

[jpow]

Originally posted by Marvin

Sanders Campaign Statement on New York Debate

They won't do a debate because of college basketball Bernie really does know his audience at least!

[Orpheus]

The NCAA finals isnt over the course of three days.

[Rob_Matteo]

Originally posted by geo

If the Sanders campaign comes up with a legitimate reason why the April 14 date is so awful then maybe the Clinton campaign will be willing to compromise. Unfortunately Bernie still needs to learn he can not control every single detail of the primaries, maybe he needs to compromise a little too.

I'm sure they have valid reasons and the Clinton campaign apparently rejected dates themselves.
It's just a disagreement, it's not a big deal, Clinton's campaign isn't entitled to choosing the dates either

Originally posted by jpow

They won't do a debate because of college basketball Bernie really does know his audience at least!

Well only makes sense to try and get the biggest audience possible for a debate.
There's still many undecideds or people saying they might switch support, it's important the public can vote for whichever candidate they actually want & it is absolutely necessary for people to understand what each candidate stands for.

[Citrus]

I would say Clinton's campaign DOES get to choose dates - she didn't have to agree to a debate in the first place. Bernie and his supporters need to learn that being uncompromising and demanding hardly ever gets you what you want.

[Marvin]

Originally posted by Orpheus

The NCAA finals isnt over the course of three days.

Okay but... there IS a game on April 4, which is what he said.

The April 15 debate would've been held in the MORNING on GMA.

BYE.

[Marvin]

Originally posted by Flare

He didn't give reasoning for any of the other two dates, why?

And even if we wanted to entertain this "conflict" of timing between the NCAA Championships being a hindrance towards Democratic debate viewership, I find that very weak for a reasoning due to a couple of things.

One is that a huge event like the Oscars airs on the same night as the Walking Dead (the biggest show on TV period right now) and these two programs air for the same demographic and generally the same type of people would watch both however, the ratings for TWD (the more frequent event) are almost unchanged by the Oscars (which comes annually). It's been like this for years now. So, why would the NCAA championship skew into the Democratic debate audience when they don't even aim for the same demographic and especially when the debates already have low viewership compared to the Republican debates? The average person only checks for the sound bits and headlines after the fact.

This is why I don't really buy that NCAA excuse. If you want to debate for the people of NY and America so badly, you'll do it on any night just to get your message out there. Bernie fans complain about lack of media presence but Bernie is outright turning down free publicity to millions all at once plus all the hooplah discussed after the debates. That's frankly disingenuous and this is ignoring the fact that his schedule is free to do the debate and his only complaint is that the NCAA Championship airs then.

The NCAA game draws attention away from the debate. He wants as much coverage on the debate as possible. Not to mention that casual watchers are going to watch the game in the same way they watch the Super Bowl. It's a huge event and anyone even remotely interested in basketball will watch that over the debate. Why have a debate on the same day as that if he knows another date would be better?

The Walking Dead is a weekly show and you can easily watch it the next day if you miss it.

[Orpheus]

Originally posted by Marvin

Okay but... there IS a game on April 4, which is what he said.

The April 15 debate would've been held in the MORNING on GMA.

BYE.

I know there's a game that day, which makes sense to not have it then. But with 3 dates already out, another set proposed by Sanders and rejected, when exactly is this debate suppose to occur?

The DNC needs to step in and mediate here. This is messy and frustrating.

[Flare]

Originally posted by Marvin

The NCAA game draws attention away from the debate. He wants as much coverage on the debate as possible. Not to mention that casual watchers are going to watch the game in the same way they watch the Super Bowl. It's a huge event and anyone even remotely interested in basketball will watch that over the debate. Why have a debate on the same day as that if he knows another date would be better?

The Walking Dead is a weekly show and you can easily watch it the next day if you miss it.

TWD's same day ratings are what I was talking about. The week before the Oscars it was like 13m, the week of the Oscars it was like 12.8m iirc.

The top paragraph doesn't make sense considering again Democratic debates weren't getting that much ratings anyways (around 8m to be exact and has went as low as 4m with no competition like NCAA this cycle). Yet we've still had the post-debate media hooplah as I explained whether or not the debate ratings were good. The publicity still exists whether people watch the debate or not. Similarly as you said, people can watch the debate the next day aswell. There's really no reason to not do a debate if you have the time when not doing the debate gives you 0 media coverage, 0 presence, 0 attention. Meanwhile, you can do the debate and still be talked about the next day whether you did bad or good, at least something will be discussed and it will be on all the news cycles for local news stations plus the big news outlets like CNN, Fox, etc. Turning down free publicity as a presidental candidate that needs it isn't going to help you.