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Discussion: U.S. Election 2016: Primary Season
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 59,596
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Quote:
Originally posted by foxaylove
It's beyond amusing to me. At the end of her service as Secretary of State, Hillary was praised on both sides as one of the best Secretaries we've ever had. Foreign leaders had renewed faith and trust in the American Government once again after it was severely diminished during George W. Bush's Administration. Videos of Trump, Lindsey Graham, and Carly Fiorina were praising her for the work she did.
They only turned on her and went back to beating her with a stick when they started remembering she'll be a frontrunner in 2016 for the Presidency. Benghazi became their new go to conspiracy to beat her down again. Then came the emails. It's like Hillary says often, the Republican work well with her in congress and outside of congress, but when she runs for something, that whole thing is forgotten. It's odd, but I get it. I don't agree with it, but I understand.
The biggest for concern some have of her is that she's "Hawkish" as they say. The no fly zone comment she made about Syria rubbed some the wrong way. The vote for the Iraq War still follows her 14 years later, while folks like Joe Biden gets a pass for it. Joe also had voted for the '94 Crime Bill, yet Hillary still gets heat for support of the bill. With the Clintons, some just love to hate them, rather it's justified or not.
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in the case of a perceived terrorist attack or rise of ISIS in the months leading up to the general election, wouldn't her "hawkishness," as some of the left refer to, actually be a strength for her instead of Trump? I can see economic collapse ushering a Trump presidency but the warnings some people are having of a god-forbid terrorist attack leading to an instant Trump victory seems a little bit shallow to me. All Hillary would have to do is remind people that she is the only person there with that kind of experience and is renowned and acclaimed for her performance in that field.
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 11/14/2008
Posts: 24,988
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Quote:
Originally posted by Retro
What really bothers me is that some of the radical lefties out there, with whom I would normally agree on many other things, try to criticize her sharply on her Secretary of State tenure solely because of their Bernie Bias. I understand those that disagree fundamentally with her performance or positions, but the bias becomes irritating when it becomes a detriment to reasonable judgment.
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What's sad is, nowadays, some extreme leftists are just as crude and awful as the crazies of the right. They piggyback and support the extreme conspiracy theorists of the right when it suits their agendas. The comments about the minority voters being low-information voters has been an unfortunate thing that people on the right have insinuated for years now. As if the same doesn't apply to several white voters. Clearly, we know better. But it's a stigma that even some people of color have adopted as well. What disappoints me the most is that several people on the left are now trying to use the same type logic against our own. Some don't come out and say it, but basically insinuate it with their words. Heck, we've seen it plenty in this thread alone.
Comments like this:
From "PROGRESSIVES" nonetheless, it's so shameful and unfortunate. We're so better than this. 
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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The Confederacy comment was just plain enraging. How is a "progressive" body going to maintain credibility while drawing comparisons between Hillary's southern support - primarily fueled by minority groups - and one of the most reprehensible periods in American history?
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 59,596
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Member Since: 11/15/2009
Posts: 16,903
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Or, if you live in red state, then your vote doesn't matter in a Democratic primary. I was deeply offended by that. Since I live in a state that will 100% vote Republican in November, the primary is the only time that my vote for president really matters. It's offensive that the Sanders camp, in a way to discredit Hillary's victories, say that those states don't matter. It doesn't matter if I live in a red state; I'm a DEMOCRAT and my vote for the Democratic nominee matters just as much as a Democrat in California, in Wisconsin, or wherever else.
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Member Since: 5/12/2012
Posts: 7,989
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Quote:
Originally posted by The Countess
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I've paid attention to their Politifact ratings for a while, but I find it hysterical that Hillary is accused of being a pathological liar and she has the best overall rating. 
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Member Since: 5/12/2012
Posts: 7,989
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Quote:
Originally posted by @michael
Or, if you live in red state, then your vote doesn't matter in a Democratic primary. I was deeply offended by that. Since I live in a state that will 100% vote Republican in November, the primary is the only time that my vote for president really matters. It's offensive that the Sanders camp, in a way to discredit Hillary's victories, say that those states don't matter. It doesn't matter if I live in a red state; I'm a DEMOCRAT and my vote for the Democratic nominee matters just as much as a Democrat in California, in Wisconsin, or wherever else.
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This! I'm in the exact same situation! 
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Member Since: 11/15/2009
Posts: 16,903
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Quote:
Originally posted by The Countess
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Wow @ Bernie being a bigger liar than Hillary  But that can't be! Bernie is an honest working man!
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ATRL Contributor
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 43,104
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bloo
I've paid attention to their Politifact ratings for a while, but I find it hysterical that Hillary is accused of being a pathological liar and she has the best overall rating. |
Kasich
Trump 
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Member Since: 3/17/2011
Posts: 987
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Quote:
Originally posted by @michael
Wow @ Bernie being a bigger liar than Hillary But that can't be! Bernie is an honest working man! |
Why are you so sure he's lying? He probably just doesn't know better. 
Same for Trump tbh. I always feel like he genuinely believes all the crap he says.
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Member Since: 7/21/2012
Posts: 28,099
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Quote:
Originally posted by @michael
Or, if you live in red state, then your vote doesn't matter in a Democratic primary. I was deeply offended by that. Since I live in a state that will 100% vote Republican in November, the primary is the only time that my vote for president really matters. It's offensive that the Sanders camp, in a way to discredit Hillary's victories, say that those states don't matter. It doesn't matter if I live in a red state; I'm a DEMOCRAT and my vote for the Democratic nominee matters just as much as a Democrat in California, in Wisconsin, or wherever else.
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!!!! Especially in my state of Louisiana where Hillary has a huge chance at turning it blue. And minority groups will drastically determine the GE outcome and the Dems need the black & hispanic vote. 
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Member Since: 11/15/2009
Posts: 16,903
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rihab95
Why are you so sure he's lying? He probably just doesn't know better.
Same for Trump tbh. I always feel like he genuinely believes all the crap he says. |
Is this supposed to be a good thing?
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 11/14/2008
Posts: 24,988
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Quote:
Originally posted by King Maxx
!!!! Especially in my state of Louisiana where Hillary has a huge chance at turning it blue. And minority groups will drastically determine the GE outcome and the Dems need the black & hispanic vote. |
!!!
I'm so pumped at Louisiana being purple this year with a possibility of going blue. Hillary had more primary votes than Trump and Cruz combined along with even Rubio as well. Then factor in more Democratic Party votes than GOP -- if we pull a 2008 North Carolina/Indiana on them.... 
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 6,474
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Quote:
Originally posted by foxaylove
Your response should be, "I'm sorry, lied under oath? When was she arrested for perjury? In the United States, you aren't guilty till proven innocent, you're innocent till proven guilty."
All the sites you had come up are all conspiracy theorists outlining their beliefs of why they thank she is a liar or has perjured herself. Fact is, she has yet to be arrested for committing perjury or charged with similar offenses, which is basically lying or falsifying info under oath. The ones that should be providing proof is them. You can stay stuff till you're blue in the face, but where are the charges? They may talk about corrupt politicians and money, but if you're going to make damaging claims like this, make sure it sticks and is 100% accurate.
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You know, you are SO right! Thank you for reaffirming my faith in Hillary 
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Member Since: 7/21/2012
Posts: 28,099
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Quote:
Originally posted by foxaylove
!!!
I'm so pumped at Louisiana being purple this year with a possibility of going blue. Hillary had more primary votes than Trump and Cruz combined along with even Rubio as well. Then factor in more Democratic Party votes than GOP -- if we pull a 2008 North Carolina/Indiana on them.... |
It's very crucial for Governor Edwards to fix this big mess we're in though or it won't happen.
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 26,316
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Watching the "Hillary Clinton lying for 13 minutes straight" video 
It's so petty actually (low-key luv it tho).
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Member Since: 9/17/2011
Posts: 9,051
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Trump is currently railing about torture...claiming he'll force the military to engage in torture methods even tho they refused to do so and believe it's a violation of international law
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 43,331
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Final FiveThirtyEight polls-plus forecasts
AZ (winner-takes-all) - polls close at 10 PM EDT
Trump 45.2
Cruz 33.9
Kasich 18.4
UT (winner-takes-all if over 50%) - caucuses end at 1 AM EDT
Cruz 58.0
Kasich 30.3
Trump 9.9
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Member Since: 7/21/2012
Posts: 28,099
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If Ted gets 50% in Utah and pulls an upset in Arizona and wins, Trump is in big trouble.
Ideally, Trump wins Arizona and Kasich takes some of Utah, Ted underperforms so Trump can get a share. 
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 43,331
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Quote:
Originally posted by King Maxx
If Ted gets 50% in Utah and pulls an upset in Arizona and wins, Trump is in big trouble.
Ideally, Trump wins Arizona and Kasich takes some of Utah, Ted underperforms so Trump can get a share. |
An AZ upset is unlikely.
Quote:
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One factor working against a Cruz upset in Arizona is that a large portion of the vote is expected to come from early voting. That means a lot of votes were cast before Rubio left the race. We’ve seen in states such as Louisiana how anti-Trump voters split their vote fairly evenly between Cruz and Rubio in early voting, only to vote in a more consolidated bloc for Cruz on primary day. It’ll be interesting to see how high a percentage of the vote Rubio gets in a state he’s no longer competing in. The higher Rubio’s share, the less likely Cruz gets a surprise win.
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+ the Brussels attacks today could sway some people. After all, he wants to temporarily ban Muslims from the country.
Cruz will almost certainly win all of the UT delegates, though.
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