But she's better at singing than Michael and Janet, better at dancing than Whitney, and better at both than Madonna kii.
She does what they all do, while they don't have the strengths of the others. Objectively, she's all of it in one package. I don't know how that's so hard to understand.
Showing a superlative talent in one component of a show doesn't give leverage. It merely means she excels at some areas that others don't.
Beyonce does not do what they all do. She has never displayed Janet or MJ's virtuosic level of dance in understanding, application, or presentation of the art form. She doesn't have Madonna's eye for visually representing a song through staging and use of props to enhance the story being told. She doesn't have Whitney's gift of voice. She may incorporate all of that in her show, but does she do it at the level of proficiency as the others? No. Similarly, with the exception of Whitney, MJ, Madonna, and Janet all do what Beyonce does. But at her level of proficiency? Aside from singing? No. So if by saying she embodies all of them, the same can be said for each of them.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
She'll give this:
this
and this
In the span of a few minutes. These are all from the same show.
The diversity is her strength. But then also the level of her execution is pretty high on all fronts.
All of which have been executed by Janet and Madonna on pretty much even given concert they've done. They're all versatile in performance. MJ and Whitney, not as much. Her execution isn't high on all fronts, which stems from her not really being a visual artist. She's a vocalist before anything.
I can see this becoming true at some point, when I saw her live a few weeks ago she slayed me so hard that I thought she was slapping for all the shade I threw at her in the past
Showing a superlative talent in one component of a show doesn't give leverage. It merely means she excels at some areas that others don't.
Beyonce does not do what they all do. She has never displayed Janet or MJ's virtuosic level of dance in understanding, application, or presentation of the art form. She doesn't have Madonna's eye for visually representing a song through staging and use of props to enhance the story being told. She doesn't have Whitney's gift of voice. She may incorporate all of that in her show, but does she do it at the level of proficiency as the others? No. Similarly, with the exception of Whitney, MJ, Madonna, and Janet all do what Beyonce does. But at her level of proficiency? Aside from singing? No. So if by saying she embodies all of them, the same can be said for each of them.
All of which have been executed by Janet and Madonna on pretty much even given concert they've done. They're all versatile in performance. MJ and Whitney, not as much. Her execution isn't high on all fronts, which stems from her not really being a visual artist. She's a vocalist before anything.
Wrong!
This is what I mean about continually comparing Beyonce to performers who lacked in an area that she has down. No one has ever sat through a Janet or Madonna vocal performance and been awed.
And Beyonce is a very visual artist. Hence her last two albums. I don't even understand why you would say that... especially in comparison to Janet, whose never put on this level of production or had such intricate interludes to go with her performances.
Beyonce's execution in DANCE, SINGING, and VISUALS is high on all fronts. The evidence is there.
Showing a superlative talent in one component of a show doesn't give leverage. It merely means she excels at some areas that others don't.
Also, this is contradictory. If she excels at some areas that the others don't, that's leverage.
And the thing, it matters. Because it shows breadth. Beyonce is able to go up on a national stage and SING the national anthem for Obama and the country. That's an arena of entertainment closed off to people like Madonna and Janet. That's important to consider.
She's in the ring with the Kellys and Mariahs and Whitneys on vocals
She's in the ring with the Madonnas and Kylies on visuals
She's in the ring with the Janets, MJs, and Ciaras on dancing
Overall, she's bringing the most to the performance table through her broad performance skill set.
This is what I mean about continually comparing Beyonce to performers who lacked in an area that she has down. No one has ever sat through a Janet or Madonna vocal performance and been awed.
Again, the same is applicable to Beyonce when it comes to Janet and Madonna. Singing is Beyonce's foremost talent, like with Janet and dance and Madonna in visuals. Beyonce has never awed anyone on those fronts.
When has Beyonce shown viruosic dance ability?
Does she have any performances where the dance IS the performance?
When has Beyonce had a visually stunning performance using props and staging to tell a story?
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
And Beyonce is a very visual artist. Hence her last two albums. I don't even understand why you would say that... especially in comparison to Janet, whose never put on this level of production or had such intricate interludes to go with her performances.
Here's a perfect example of why understanding context is important. Were productions that Beyonce have available to Janet and Madonna during their time as peak performers? No. They worked with what they had:
It wasn't until recent years when technology became a component in live shows:
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
Beyonce's execution in DANCE, SINGING, and VISUALS is high on all fronts. The evidence is there.
She executes well in singing. Execution in dance is poor. She, like all of the hive, doesn't understand that technicality is more important than showmanship. She doesn't present dance as an art form. She uses it to complement the overall performance. Poor technical skills, over accentuates expressive skills, over dances, and her routines often lack organization and/or storytelling. So while you all think she's "slaying" and "going off", she's really just dismissing all aspects of technical skills in dance and quite possibly causing herself injury. She's already losing agility and flexibility (noticed this at her show I attended this year). This is part of the reason why she's not a true dancer, and why dance isn't one of her talents. It's more of a skill she learned. Execution in visuals isn't great. Often times the organization is lacking, the props and costumes don't enhance the story, and she gets lost in the mix.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
Also, this is contradictory. If she excels at some areas that the others don't, that's leverage.
In regards to performance as a whole art.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
And the thing, it matters. Because it shows breadth. Beyonce is able to go up on a national stage and SING the national anthem for Obama and the country. That's an arena of entertainment closed off to people like Madonna and Janet. That's important to consider.
Common sense says this is for vocalists. But not as much considering Ciara has sang the national anthem.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
She's in the ring with Kellys and Mariahs and Whitneys on vocals
Don't make let Chimier see this.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
She's in the ring with the Madonnas and Kylies on visuals
At their level? No. Just incorporating it into the show isn't enough. There has to be a comparable level of proficiency to be "in the ring with". It has to make sense. This is why organization is important in live shows.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
She's in the rings with the Janets, MJs, and Ciaras on dancing
With the way she can't combine technical and expressive skills of dance?
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
Overall, she's bringing the most to the performance table through her broad performance skill set.
Again, the same is applicable to Beyonce when it comes to Janet and Madonna. Singing is Beyonce's foremost talent, like with Janet and dance and Madonna in visuals. Beyonce has never awed anyone on those fronts.
When has Beyonce shown viruosic dance ability?
Does she have any performances where the dance IS the performance?
I'm sorry, but the bolded is just not true. Everyone was talking about the BBMA powerpoint. Everyone was talking about the phenomenal stage set for her recent VMA performance. She has AWED people on all those fronts. From Single Ladies to Don't Hurt Yourself. People have been impressed by her dancing and visual elements.
So far as performances where dance is the performance. I'll admit she hasn't done that. Why? Because she'd probably rather focus on the entire experience. Which again, is why I'm saying she's the best performer. She gives it ALL, but in metered and necessary doses. All her performances are extremely balanced, so they feel complete.
That said, she has shown the same aptitude for dancing as Janet or MJ. Which is a strong indicator of where she can take it. But again, given her preference for balance, she's wary not to over-choreograph (as she once pointed out in a bts video). However, she's very comfortable with intricate and big moves.
1:35
Quote:
Originally posted by Mr. Wonder
When has Beyonce had a visually stunning performance using props and staging to tell a story?
Execution in visuals isn't great. Often times the organization is lacking, the props and costumes don't enhance the story, and she gets lost in the mix.
She literally did just that for the VMAs.
This has already been debunked. VMA 2016 proved that none of what you're saying in terms of lacking organization, props, costume, or story telling is true. You don't just pull off a 15 minute performance without any of those things being considered.
Quote:
Originally posted by Mr. Wonder
She executes well in singing. Execution in dance is poor. She, like all of the hive, doesn't understand that technicality is more important than showmanship. She doesn't present dance as an art form. She uses it to complement the overall performance. Poor technical skills, over accentuates expressive skills, over dances, and her routines often lack organization and/or storytelling. So while you all think she's "slaying" and "going off", she's really just dismissing all aspects of technical skills in dance and quite possibly causing herself injury. She's already losing agility and flexibility (noticed this at her show I attended this year). This is part of the reason why she's not a true dancer, and why dance isn't one of her talents. It's more of a skill she learned.
After Single Ladies, no one will ever agree she executes poorly in dancing. I'm sorry. You can knock at the rigor of her choreo, cause she admittedly holds back in order to give a vocal, but really, she delivers on all the dance styles she uses.
And I'm starting to get the sense that "presenting dance as an art form" is a subjective appraisal of her skills. There's literally no one way to assess execution in the context of hip hop dance except through tight and purposed delivery of the moves. It's not like ballet where you can be like "oh, you hit the pirouette wrong". Much of hip hop dance has to do with flavor, it's not a classical dance art form with so many rules, forms, and structures.
Quote:
Originally posted by Mr. Wonder
Common sense says this is for vocalists. But not as much considering Ciara has sang the national anthem.
At their level? No. Just incorporating it into the show isn't enough. There has to be a comparable level of proficiency to be "in the ring with". It has to make sense. This is why organization is important in live shows.
With the way she can't combine technical and expressive skills of dance?
Ciara was dragged for her vocal skills (or lack thereof, in the same way Janet and Madonna would be for trying...like Madonna got dragged for her terrible Nothing Compares 2 U cover). As you would say, their execution in singing is poor.
And "in the ring" means exactly that. She's good enough to be in consideration with those folks. She may not be the Whitney in singing or the Janet dancing, but she's COMPARABLE to Whitney or Janet in their respective realms. Meanwhile no one would think to compare Whitney to Janet for dancing or Janet to Whitney for singing. So Beyonce does exhibits a high level of proficiency in both skills because you can say she's a great vocalist and a skilled dancer. That's what makes her the consummate performer.
I'm sorry, but the bolded is just not true. Everyone was talking about the BBMA powerpoint. Everyone was talking about the phenomenal stage set for her recent VMA performance. She has AWED people on all those fronts. From Single Ladies to Don't Hurt Yourself. People have been impressed by her dancing and visual elements.
They're impressed by the technology she's using in her performance. Not how she actually incorporates it as part of the story. Look at the Madonna performance. Voguing is a pop form of dance in the Black gay ballroom scene. Fashion is a big part of that. Madonna incorporates the dance style, and respects the scene by employing the fashion of time periods to visually illustrate that aspect of the culture. That's what's meant when I say "visually stunning". Everything makes sense. Organization - something Beyonce doesn't understand.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
So far as performances where dance is the performance. I'll admit she hasn't done that. Why? Because she'd probably rather focus on the entire experience. Which again, is why I'm saying she's the best performer. She gives it ALL, but in metered and necessary doses. All her performances are extremely balanced, so they feel complete.
Because dance isn't one of her talents, which is what I've been telling you. So she's never awed in dance, which is also what I said.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
That said, she has shown the same aptitude for dancing as Janet or MJ. Which is a strong indicator of where she can take it. But again, given her preference for balance, she's wary not to over-choreograph (as she once pointed out in a bts video). However, she's very comfortable with intricate and big moves.
1:35
Aptitude implies natural ability. Beyonce doesn't have dance as a natural ability. She has rhythm, and can move to a beat, but she doesn't have a natural gift of dance. And that video doesn't help your argument. It just shows how simplistic her routines are.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
She literally did just that for the VMAs.
This has already been debunked. VMA 2016 proved that none of what you're saying in terms of lacking organization, props, costume, or story telling is true. You don't just pull off a 15 minute performance without any of those things being considered.
This was one of the few times where her visuals actually made sense.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
After Single Ladies, no one will ever agree she executes poorly in dancing. I'm sorry. You can knock at the rigor of her choreo, cause she admittedly holds back in order to give a vocal, but really, she delivers on all the dance styles she uses.
This dance break is not good. In dance, the back/rib cage should sit directly over the pelvis so that alignment is correct and the dancer can move freely. From the ear to the ankle should be a straight line. Posture is one of the technical skills that escapes Beyonce whenever she attempts to dance. Around :15 she almost loses her balance twice (notice the right left catching her both times she swings back). Also her back is hyper extended pretty much throughout the dance break. Improper posture vs. Proper posture:
You tell me which one Beyonce is doing in that dance break. And another example:
Notice as she comes out of the spin, she's crunched over to her left side? That's because her turn isn't centered, and once again, she almost loses her balance. That comes as a result of over dancing. She almost loses her balance because of poor foot placement. And her posture is badly off - crunched over, back isn't aligned, so consequently the turn is just horrid.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
And I'm starting to get the sense that "presenting dance as an art form" is a subjective appraisal of her skills.
Presenting dance as an art form isn't subjective, it's a talent. And there's nothing to appraise because she has no real dance skills, technically speaking.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
There's literally no one way to assess execution in the context of hip hop dance except through tight and purposed delivery of the moves. It's not like ballet where you can be like "oh, you hit the pirouette wrong". Much of hip hop dance has to do with flavor, it's not a classical dance art form with so many rules, forms, and structures.
This is absolutely ridiculous. All dance is codified in one way or another. Technical skills aren't limited to ballet because they give all styles of dance a foundation for movement, even ballet. Hip-hop is just as technical. For example, popping incorporates isolations, which technically requires posture, alignment, mobility, control, and flexibility. Breaking incorporates flexibility, timing, stamina, and coordination. "You hi the pirouette wrong" is an example of poor execution because the technique wasn't properly performed.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
Ciara was dragged for her vocal skills (or lack thereof, in the same way Janet and Madonna would be for trying...like Madonna got dragged for her terrible Nothing Compares 2 U cover). As you would say, their execution in singing is poor.
Well for Ciara and Madonna, they just flat out can't sing. Janet can sing, sings in the center of pitch and sings in tune, among other things. Her gift of voice isn't as great as Beyonce's. Similarly, Beyonce's gift of dance isn't as great as Janet's.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
And "in the ring" means exactly that. She's good enough to be in consideration with those folks. She may not be the Whitney in singing or the Janet dancing, but she's COMPARABLE to Whitney or Janet in their respective realms. Meanwhile no one would think to compare Whitney to Janet for dancing or Janet to Whitney for singing. So Beyonce does exhibits a high level of proficiency in both skills because you can say she's a great vocalist and a skilled dancer. That's what makes her the consummate performer.
So you're saying she's good enough to be compared to Janet in dance and Whitney and singing even though her gift in those respective areas pales considerably in comparison to theirs? Beyonce is more of a jack of all trades, master of none. She has a healthy balance of all the components of her show, but there is no level of exceptional display of any one of those components aside from singing. What ppl like most about Beyonce on stage is that she's energetic and she can sing. And when you compare her to others, you start to see where she falls short. And if you're talking consummate performer, out of all the ladies discussed, only Madonna has played an instrument live, which is another component of live performing. So there is no true consummate performer.
^you are just really bothered Bey snatched Janet's foccils as a performer. Your arguments are not valid because it becomes evident you just can't take Bey getting praised and being deemed as the best performer.
BTW: You posted the video of Janet's If performance as an argument regarding her dancing abilities. I found it pretty boring tbh. Bey has done way more exciting choreo. SL and RTW are way more intricate than what Janet performed during If.
They're impressed by the technology she's using in her performance. Not how she actually incorporates it as part of the story. Look at the Madonna performance. Voguing is a pop form of dance in the Black gay ballroom scene. Fashion is a big part of that. Madonna incorporates the dance style, and respects the scene by employing the fashion of time periods to visually illustrate that aspect of the culture. That's what's meant when I say "visually stunning". Everything makes sense. Organization - something Beyonce doesn't understand.
Because dance isn't one of her talents, which is what I've been telling you. So she's never awed in dance, which is also what I said.
Aptitude implies natural ability. Beyonce doesn't have dance as a natural ability. She has rhythm, and can move to a beat, but she doesn't have a natural gift of dance. And that video doesn't help your argument. It just shows how simplistic her routines are.
This was one of the few times where her visuals actually made sense.
This dance break is not good. In dance, the back/rib cage should sit directly over the pelvis so that alignment is correct and the dancer can move freely. From the ear to the ankle should be a straight line. Posture is one of the technical skills that escapes Beyonce whenever she attempts to dance. Around :15 she almost loses her balance twice (notice the right left catching her both times she swings back). Also her back is hyper extended pretty much throughout the dance break. Improper posture vs. Proper posture:
You tell me which one Beyonce is doing in that dance break. And another example:
Notice as she comes out of the spin, she's crunched over to her left side? That's because her turn isn't centered, and once again, she almost loses her balance. That comes as a result of over dancing. She almost loses her balance because of poor foot placement. And her posture is badly off - crunched over, back isn't aligned, so consequently the turn is just horrid.
Presenting dance as an art form isn't subjective, it's a talent. And there's nothing to appraise because she has no real dance skills, technically speaking.
This is absolutely ridiculous. All dance is codified in one way or another. Technical skills aren't limited to ballet because they give all styles of dance a foundation for movement, even ballet. Hip-hop is just as technical. For example, popping incorporates isolations, which technically requires posture, alignment, mobility, control, and flexibility. Breaking incorporates flexibility, timing, stamina, and coordination. "You hi the pirouette wrong" is an example of poor execution because the technique wasn't properly performed.
Well for Ciara and Madonna, they just flat out can't sing. Janet can sing, sings in the center of pitch and sings in tune, among other things. Her gift of voice isn't as great as Beyonce's. Similarly, Beyonce's gift of dance isn't as great as Janet's.
So you're saying she's good enough to be compared to Janet in dance and Whitney and singing even though her gift in those respective areas pales considerably in comparison to theirs? Beyonce is more of a jack of all trades, master of none. She has a healthy balance of all the components of her show, but there is no level of exceptional display of any one of those components aside from singing. What ppl like most about Beyonce on stage is that she's energetic and she can sing. And when you compare her to others, you start to see where she falls short. And if you're talking consummate performer, out of all the ladies discussed, only Madonna has played an instrument live, which is another component of live performing. So there is no true consummate performer.
Well it's a good thing Beyoncé isn't a contestant on So You Think You Can Dance. Listen, no one is saying Beyoncé has an exceptional technical ability in dancing, it's not her strong suit or main talent like it is for Janet and MJ, so yes she makes some mistakes. It's not so much about perfect execution for her as it is her energy and stage presence. Bottom line is Beyoncé is a better dancer than Madonna, Janet and Michael are singers, and arguably a better singer than they are dancers. And your argument about her visuals not being stunning or impressive is extremely biased and almost comical especially after her performances in recent years.
They're impressed by the technology she's using in her performance. Not how she actually incorporates it as part of the story. Look at the Madonna performance. Voguing is a pop form of dance....
That's called theater, any one of these popstars can incorporate it.
Quote:
Originally posted by Mr. Wonder
Because dance isn't one of her talents....
She doesn't over-choreograph because dance isn't her only talent. And also, dance is a learned skill. The only natural components to it are rhythm and timing. Once have that, you can learn to execute pretty much anything. That's an important distinction to make from other "talents" which come more naturally and are rigid like singing.
This dance break is not good. In dance, the back/rib cage should sit directly over the pelvis so that alignment is correct and the dancer can move freely. From the ear to the ankle should be a straight line. Posture is one of the technical skills that escapes Beyonce whenever she attempts to dance. Around :15 she almost loses her balance twice (notice the right left catching her both times she swings back). Also her back is hyper extended pretty much throughout the dance break. Improper posture vs. Proper posture:
You tell me which one Beyonce is doing in that dance break. And another example:
Notice as she comes out of the spin, she's crunched over to her left side? That's because her turn isn't centered, and once again, she almost loses her balance. That comes as a result of over dancing. She almost loses her balance because of poor foot placement. And her posture is badly off - crunched over, back isn't aligned, so consequently the turn is just horrid.
Presenting dance as an art form isn't subjective, it's a talent. And there's nothing to appraise because she has no real dance skills, technically speaking.
This is absolutely ridiculous. All dance is codified in one way or another. Technical skills aren't limited to ballet because they give all styles of dance a foundation for movement, even ballet. Hip-hop is just as technical. For example, popping incorporates isolations, which technically requires posture, alignment, mobility, control, and flexibility. Breaking incorporates flexibility, timing, stamina, and coordination. "You hi the pirouette wrong" is an example of poor execution because the technique wasn't properly performed.
This whole analysis of dancing is soooo rigid and actually doesn't factor into so much hip hop dance.
What yore actually doing is criticizing her style. Which is fair, but again too subjective to use as a measure of her lack of dancing talent. In reality, hip hop dance continually breaks all these rules you say Beyoncé isn't adhering too.
I've been too engrossed in hip hop dance culture to eat up what you're writing. Seriously, all you have to do is watch Paris and her dance crew on the Sorry (Justin Beiber) video and literally everything you said Beyoncé shouldn't do is being done.
Hip hop is not ballet or ballroom or salsa. It's a less measured form of dance expression.
Also, this is contradictory. If she excels at some areas that the others don't, that's leverage.
It's not. This is music, not maths. It would only hold leverage if each area was as defined and as strong as each other, but they're not. Singing by far is her best area. What Beyonce has been able to do is synergize the singing, the dancing, stage presence and visuals into a very streamlined style of performance. That's why she's a great performer. Not because she does 130583059409 things.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
And the thing, it matters. Because it shows breadth. Beyonce is able to go up on a national stage and SING the national anthem for Obama and the country. That's an arena of entertainment closed off to people like Madonna and Janet. That's important to consider.
She's in the ring with the Kellys and Mariahs and Whitneys on vocals
She's in the ring with the Madonnas and Kylies on visuals
She's in the ring with the Janets, MJs, and Ciaras on dancing
Kelly who? Rowland? Clarkson? Neither are in the ring with Mariah or Whitney.
And Beyonce is not in the ring with Janet, MJ or Ciara in dancing.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
Overall, she's bringing the most to the performance table through her broad performance skill set.
It's not about bringing the most, but bringing the BEST. Beyonce is the best performer of her generation because her style of performance. It's synergistic. It accomplishes more together than the individual parts would do alone. And the quality is on a higher level than her peers.
^you are just really bothered Bey snatched Janet's foccils as a performer. Your arguments are not valid because it becomes evident you just can't take Bey getting praised and being deemed as the best performer.
BTW: You posted the video of Janet's If performance as an argument regarding her dancing abilities. I found it pretty boring tbh. Bey has done way more exciting choreo. SL and RTW are way more intricate than what Janet performed during If.
Beyoncé could never do If. And she danced ahead of the music in the last minute of the Single Ladies video and struggled with the footwork in Run the World. It isn't surprising though, footwork has never been her forte.
Quote:
Originally posted by PrettyHurts
Well it's a good thing Beyoncé isn't a contestant on So You Think You Can Dance. Listen, no one is saying Beyoncé has an exceptional technical ability in dancing, it's not her strong suit or main talent like it is for Janet and MJ, so yes she makes some mistakes. It's not so much about perfect execution for her as it is her energy and stage presence. Bottom line is Beyoncé is a better dancer than Madonna, Janet and Michael are singers, and arguably a better singer than they are dancers. And your argument about her visuals not being stunning or impressive is extremely biased and almost comical especially after her performances in recent years.
But people are saying she has exceptional ability in dance. When you say things like "she's in the ring with Janet when it comes to dance," you're basically saying she has exceptional ability without actually saying it.
Quote:
Originally posted by Destiny
As if Janet has ever been hailed as the best female performer ... I've always seen people praise Tina Turner before and now it's Beyoncé
You need to come out from under that rock you've been under and get some fresh air. Janet is heralded as one of the best female performers, and has been since 1990.
Quote:
Originally posted by Sunshine.
That's called theater, any one of these popstars can incorporate it.
She doesn't over-choreograph because dance isn't her only talent. And also, dance is a learned skill. The only natural components to it are rhythm and timing. Once have that, you can learn to execute pretty much anything. That's an important distinction to make from other "talents" which come more naturally and are rigid like singing.
This whole analysis of dancing is soooo rigid and actually doesn't factor into so much hip hop dance.
What yore actually doing is criticizing her style. Which is fair, but again too subjective to use as a measure of her lack of dancing talent. In reality, hip hop dance continually breaks all these rules you say Beyoncé isn't adhering too.
I've been too engrossed in hip hop dance culture to eat up what you're writing. Seriously, all you have to do is watch Paris and her dance crew on the Sorry (Justin Beiber) video and literally everything you said Beyoncé shouldn't do is being done.
Hip hop is not ballet or ballroom or salsa. It's a less measured form of dance expression.
Are these people too not "dancers"?
You're basically reiterating what Mr. Wonder stated. Beyoncé is good when it comes to expressive styled choreography, but she's flawed when it comes to the technical component. And you also displayed how limited she is by only bringing up street-styled contemporary dance and not any other styles that she can do. Beyoncé is good with street-styled choreography as well as African-inspired dance because those dances are more expressive and less technical. In dance, both the technical and expressive components are essential, but the technical aspect is even more important. This is where Beyoncé falls short, and Janet excels. Janet can combine the expressive and technical aspects of dance and create seamless choreography. Case in Point: Rhythm Nation. Janet can also do a wider array of styles than Beyoncé can. Versatility is also important in dance. Again, an area Beyoncé lacks in.
You're basically reiterating what Mr. Wonder stated. Beyoncé is good when it comes to expressive styled choreography, but she's flawed when it comes to the technical component. And you also displayed how limited she is by only bringing up street-styled contemporary dance and not any other styles that she can do. Beyoncé is good with street-styled choreography as well as African-inspired dance because those dances are more expressive and less technical. In dance, both the technical and expressive components are essential, but the technical aspect is even more important. This is where Beyoncé falls short, and Janet excels. Janet can combine the expressive and technical aspects of dance and create seamless choreography. Case in Point: Rhythm Nation. Janet can also do a wider array of styles than Beyoncé can. Versatility is also important in dance. Again, an area Beyoncé lacks in.
We're essentially recycling the same argument with one another at this point. Beyoncé is a technical vocalist & combines it with expressive aspects to create seamless vocal runs while Janet does that with choreography. Each has their own specialty but in terms of performances, Beyoncé is a better live dancer than Janet is a live vocalist. Not to mention Beyoncé has popularized quite a few of her choreographies so there's clearly a demand for it.
We're essentially recycling the same argument with one another at this point. Beyoncé is a technical vocalist & combines it with expressive aspects to create seamless vocal runs while Janet does that with choreography. Each has their own specialty but in terms of performances, Beyoncé is a better live dancer than Janet is a live vocalist. Not to mention Beyoncé has popularized quite a few of her choreographies so there's clearly a demand for it.
And Janet is a better live dancer than Beyonce is a live vocalist. See how it works both ways? So you're not really proving or saying anything.
We're essentially recycling the same argument with one another at this point. Beyoncé is a technical vocalist & combines it with expressive aspects to create seamless vocal runs while Janet does that with choreography. Each has their own specialty but in terms of performances, Beyoncé is a better live dancer than Janet is a live vocalist.
Quote:
Originally posted by Chimier
And Janet is a better live dancer than Beyonce is a live vocalist. See how it works both ways? So you're not really proving or saying anything.
Basically.
Quote:
Originally posted by T-Swizz
Not to mention Beyoncé has popularized quite a few of her choreographies so there's clearly a demand for it.
Beyonce's choreography hasn't done anything to push the medium forward whatsoever. Rhythm Nation, on the other hand, completely changed the dance world and helped bring organized, full troupe choreography to the forefront. A style Beyoncé uses. And just because Single Ladies was a popular dance, doesn't make her a dancer. The Macarena was also popular, arguably even more popular. Does that make the choreographers of it dancers? The fact that Single Ladies was so easily imitated proves how simplistic her choreography is, ala Macarena.
