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Discussion: U.S. Election 2016: Primary Season
Member Since: 4/4/2014
Posts: 10,514
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bloo
Suing the Democratic party, talking about how corrupt they are, only becoming one to be eligible for primary votes, to want them to change entirely when you're a newcomer, to complain about their super delegate system and then flip to saying you need them to win the nomination and you're banking on them, raising practically no money to help democrats get into positions across the country, and more making him a bad Democrat.
Even if you think he's a great Democrat, he's unquestionably failing in comparison to Hillary.
You can think he's a wonderful progressive, liberal, politician, visionary, whatever. But he is not a good Democrat by any rational measure.
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Member Since: 5/12/2012
Posts: 7,989
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mike91
Free education
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She's campaigning for debt-free tuition because she thinks it's more doable for the time being... 
She's been for this since the 90s...
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And don't sit here and tell me Hillary will be tough on Wall St. (the main source of the problem) considering the money she takes from them.
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I could easily flip this argument to "And don't sit here and tell me Bernie will be tough on the NRA and guns (the main source of the problem for school shootings) considering the money they've spent on him."
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Member Since: 8/7/2015
Posts: 11,012
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mike91
Free education, universal healthcare, etc are NOT Hillary's campaign. And don't sit here and tell me Hillary will be tough on Wall St. (the main source of the problem) considering the money she takes from them.
edit: Also technically the entire democratic party supports socialists policies and putting more of them into place. Only difference is that Bernie isn't afraid to admit it.
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I'll give you that, universal healthcare is something all countries should have.
Free education? I couldn't disagree more. Indeed, Hillary's debt-free initiative is more absolute and reasonable.
By the way, not all rich people are connected to Wall Street. You didn't mention Wall Street in your post As far as Wall Street is concerned, as Hillary said, Obama passed the toughest regulations on Wall Street since the Great Depression despite taking huge donations.
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Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 21,143
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I can't wait to see Bernie's fundraising haul after today
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Member Since: 6/20/2012
Posts: 8,593
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Suing my school doesn't make me a bad student, suing my employer doesn't make me a bad employee, suing my party doesn't make me a bad party member, etc.
You sue when you think injustice is occurring, the court decides the rest. Suing doesn't make you a bad anything.
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Member Since: 5/12/2012
Posts: 7,989
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Quote:
Originally posted by heckinglovato
Suing my school doesn't make me a bad student, suing my employer doesn't make me a bad employee, suing my party doesn't make me a party member, etc.
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This would be a fine comparison if we were saying Bernie suing the party makes him a bad politician (a more general term). But, to be a Democratic politician, you have to advocate for the party and you represent the party. Him suing the party effectively makes him a bad advocate for the party. You can't say a student that sued a school is a good advocate for the school. Terrible argument.
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Member Since: 8/6/2015
Posts: 3,624
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bloo
Suing the Democratic party, talking about how corrupt they are, only becoming one to be eligible for primary votes, to want them to change entirely when you're a newcomer, to complain about their super delegate system and then flip to saying you need them to win the nomination and you're banking on them, raising practically no money to help democrats get into positions across the country, and more making him a bad Democrat.
Even if you think he's a great Democrat, he's unquestionably failing in comparison to Hillary.
You can think he's a wonderful progressive, liberal, politician, visionary, whatever. But he is not a good Democrat by any rational measure.
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I agree 100%
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 16,870
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I need a debate with Bern/Hill vs Cruz/Trump. The ratings.
Im sure Trump would call out Bernie's finger waving huff and puff.
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Member Since: 8/6/2015
Posts: 3,624
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Quote:
Originally posted by Citrus
I can't wait to see Bernie's fundraising haul after today
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Unfortunately, money won't buy Bernie the minority/educated middle class/elder vote 
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Member Since: 6/29/2012
Posts: 13,597
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Congrats to Bernie. It's a real competition now
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Member Since: 6/20/2012
Posts: 8,593
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bloo
Suing my school doesn't make me a bad student, suing my employer doesn't make me a bad employee, suing my party doesn't make me a party member, etc./QUOTE]
This would be a fine comparison if we were saying Bernie suing the party makes him a bad politician. But, to be a Democrat, means you have to advocate for the party and that you represent the party. Him suing the party effectively makes him a bad advocate for the party. You can't say a student that sued a school is a good advocate for the school. Terrible argument.
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He's trying to clear his party of flaws so he can advocate for what he thinks it's right. I can't believe you're actually implying he shouldn't be suing a major political party when he thinks that injustice is occuring just because he needs to be an "advocate" for the party. In order to be an advocate, you have to advocate for what you think is right, not follow everything like a sheep and ignore mistakes and injustices.
You can certainly love the school and feel passionate about advocating for it, but not until you sue because your principal, for example, forced you to enter the opposite gender's bathroom because you're transgender. It doesn't make you a bad student, it doesn't make you a bad advocate for the school, it just means there's a flaw you're publicly willing to address and get fixed.
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Member Since: 5/12/2012
Posts: 7,989
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Quote:
Originally posted by heckinglovato
He's trying to clear his party of flaws so he can advocate for what he thinks it's right. I can't believe you're actually implying he shouldn't be suing a major political party when he thinks that injustice is occuring just because he needs to be an "advocate" for the party. In order to be an advocate, you have to advocate for what you think is right, not follow everything like a sheep and ignore mistakes and injustices.
You can certainly love the school and feel passionate about advocating for it, but not until you sue because your principal, for example, forced you to enter the opposite gender's bathroom because you're transgender. It doesn't make you a bad student, it doesn't make you a bad advocate for the school, it just means there's a flaw you're publicly willing to address and get fixed.
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He has been an Independent for 40 years... HOW is the Democratic Party his party...?! I've been a Democrat much longer and I've only been eligible to be registered under any party for a few years.
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Member Since: 6/20/2012
Posts: 8,593
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Quote:
Originally posted by HeyMr.DJ
Unfortunately, money won't buy Bernie the minority/educated middle class/elder vote |
Same way it won't buy Hillary the millennial or progressive vote. I don't get how labelling people and dividing them into sanctions is a productive and healthy argument here. Stop.
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Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 26,488
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Bernie is as good of a Democrat as Trump is a martian.
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Member Since: 6/20/2012
Posts: 8,593
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bloo
He has been an Independent for 40 years... HOW is the Democratic Party his party...?! I've been a Democrat much longer and I've only been eligible to be registered under any party for a few years.
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It's his party because he's a member of it. Congrats on being a Democrat for longer than Bernie but Bernie is still a Democrat and has every right to address the party's flaws. It doesn't matter if the transgender student is a freshman, or someone who just moved to the district, etc.
Please don't nitpick ONE word of my entire argument and take it out of context.
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Member Since: 5/12/2012
Posts: 7,989
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Quote:
Originally posted by heckinglovato
It's his party because he's a member of it. Congrats on being a Democrat for longer than Bernie but Bernie is still a Democrat and has every right to address the party's flaws. It doesn't matter if the transgender student is a freshman, or someone who just moved to the district, etc.
Please don't nitpick ONE word of my entire argument and take it out of context.
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When he still doesn't self-identify as a Democrat, then it's a tad different...
And I didn't take it out of context. I read the rest of your post. It was territory we've already covered.
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Member Since: 8/6/2015
Posts: 3,624
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Quote:
Originally posted by heckinglovato
It's his party because he's a member of it. Congrats on being a Democrat for longer than Bernie but Bernie is still a Democrat and has every right to address the party's flaws. It doesn't matter if the transgender student is a freshman, or someone who just moved to the district, etc.
Please don't nitpick ONE word of my entire argument and take it out of context.
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Why are you up everyone's a** gosh I don't understand...
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Member Since: 6/20/2012
Posts: 8,593
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bloo
When he still doesn't refer to himself as a Democrat, then it's a tad different... |
No, it isn't. You're twisting details but this is a dead-end. Suspected injustices are to be dealt with seriously and expected to result in strict consequemces. Suing the DNC because a selected group of people have been at suspected fault doesn't make you a bad Democrat or a bad advocate for the party. Same way the transgender student suing the school because of an administrator at the main office committing injustice towards them doesn't make them a bad advocate for the school.
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Member Since: 5/12/2012
Posts: 7,989
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Quote:
Originally posted by heckinglovato
No, it isn't. You're twisting details but this is a dead-end. Suspected injustices are to be dealt with seriously and expected to result in strict consequemces. Suing the DNC because a selected group of people have been at suspected fault doesn't make you a bad Democrat or a bad advocate for the party. Same way the transgender student suing the school because of an administrator at the main office committing injustice towards them doesn't make them a bad advocate for the school.
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Yes it does... A transgender student would not be suing a school because of an administrator if they did not self-identify and live as transgender...
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Member Since: 1/20/2012
Posts: 27,830
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Quote:
Originally posted by HeyMr.DJ
Why are you up everyone's a** gosh I don't understand...
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The irony
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