It's just offensive when my support of a candidate is reduced to me not having done my research. It's because of my research that I support Clinton over Sanders. Really, the attitude of some Bernie fans that anyone not in line is simply ignorant is troublesome. It's especially problematic that, when minority voters possibly prefer Hillary, they simply aren't "educated" on the issues. That's condescending as hell.
It's just offensive when my support of a candidate is reduced to me not having done my research. It's because of my research that I support Clinton over Sanders. Really, the attitude of some Bernie fans that anyone not in line is simply ignorant is troublesome. It's especially problematic that minority voters can't possibly prefer Hillary, they simply aren't "educated" on the issues. That's condescending as hell.
Thank you.
Bernie is a good candidate but his supporters (everywhere) seem to have that condescending theme going on. I am with you, I know my research
And you beat me to it Vlad! I would like to point out that, unlike yesterday, this pollster has a B rating (yesterday's pollster had a C- rating)
And shaming black people or gay people for supporting Hillary is a dirty tactic, in the same league with Albright's and Steinem's comments. Both are deplorable.
It's just offensive when my support of a candidate is reduced to me not having done my research. It's because of my research that I support Clinton over Sanders. Really, the attitude of some Bernie fans that anyone not in line is simply ignorant is troublesome. It's especially problematic that, when minority voters possibly prefer Hillary, they simply aren't "educated" on the issues. That's condescending as hell.
I'm sorry but what have I said that's been a lie? The Clinton's HAVE had a very negative effect on the black community and have expressed very anti-gay views in the past. Doesn't matter if Clinton was only the first lady, she was very active politically as first lady. It's not like she sat around picking which flowers to display in the Blue room during that time. She knew damn well she had her own political ambitions, hence why she ran for the Senate right after her husband left office.
And yes, there is a lack of research that's happened with Clinton supporters. If you're not dismissing every negative thing Hillary has done as being no big deal or "SHE'S CHANGED!!", you're trying to use Bernie's votes in the house on certain bills against him. Most bills in the house come in packages, this is a known fact. If he didn't vote for the Crime Bill, then you all would be using the fact he didn't support the Violence Against Women act that was also attached to that legislation. That's why he got in front of everyone and spoke out against that part of the bill. Do you all not know how the Senate works?
Quit trying to victimize yourselves all the time. You're all always so damn condescending, yet have the nerve to say the same thing about Sanders' supporters. You try acting like you're above all of it. Newsflash, you're not and that's evidenced by some of the crap a lot of Clinton supporters have come in here to say about Bernie. Not to mention the pathetic attempts at smearing Bernie by her own endorsers, which all backfired on them.
I'm sorry but what have I said that's been a lie? The Clinton's HAVE had a very negative effect on the black community and have expressed very anti-gay views in the past. Doesn't matter if Clinton was only the first lady, she was very active politically as first lady. It's not like she sat around picking which flowers to display in the Blue room during that time. She knew damn well she had her own political ambitions, hence why she ran for the Senate right after her husband left office.
And yes, there is a lack of research that's happened with Clinton supporters. If you're not dismissing every negative thing Hillary has done as being no big deal or "SHE'S CHANGED!!", you're trying to use Bernie's votes in the house on certain bills against him. Most bills in the house come in packages, this is a known fact. If he didn't vote for the Crime Bill, then you all would be using the fact he didn't support the Violence Against Women act that was also attached to that legislation. That's why he got in front of everyone and spoke out against that part of the bill. Do you all not know how the Senate works?
Quit trying to victimize yourselves all the time. You're all always so damn condescending, yet have the nerve to say the same thing about Sanders' supporters. You try acting like you're above all of it. Newsflash, you're not and that's evidenced by some of the crap a lot of Clinton supporters have come in here to say about Bernie. Not to mention the pathetic attempts at smearing Bernie by her own endorsers, which all backfired on them.
Okay let us be frank here. There is a reason Bill Clinton was coined the first black president because of what he did for that community wth the help of Hill. Sure there have been some missteps like the Crime Bill (which again Sanders voted for, he doesn't get off Scot free) but overall after he left office he had over an 80% approval rating from black citizens. This notion you're trying to push that either Clinton had some kind of detrimental affect on blacks is a lie. Outright. You look like you could do a little research if you disagree.
If he voted against the bill no one would be accusing him for not supporting the violence against women initiative because you don't get blamed for sub-ideas in bills. Only the overall bill itself. Anyways republicans actually were here for the Crime Bill but almost all decided to vote against it because of last minute legislative added to it that they didn't like. Sanders could have done the same but he didn't so he's to blame since you know, he actually voted for the bill.
Nothing Citrus said was condescending. He, like many of the Clinton supporters in here, have done our research which led us to support the candidate we do. What is condescending is saying "how can blacks vote for her" (I found that highly offensive). What is condescending is rhetoric like "if they did their research they wouldn't be supporting her." What is condescending is that all over Facebook and Twitter you have supporters of Sanders say once they learn about Sanders' policies they'd support him because it's better for "us", grouping us into a box and saying we're all the same and should be voting the same.
With that being said, you're free to support whoever for whatever reason but do not come for us with your spiel of "you need to do your research" or "why are blacks supporting her" when Sanders hasn't done anything with his Senate/House powers to improve the lives of blacks. Hell, Latinos either. That's why both of my parents (a Latino and black) aren't completely sold on Sanders. Let's not kid ourselves thinking you're above it, you've been very condescending as well
Hillary's camp has to feel good about that YouGov poll. They have her up 19 despite getting trounced 63-36 among whites (zero percent chance she loses whites by that margin).
Both YouGov and ARG suggest that she's maintained her large lead with black voters. Perhaps these voters didn't appreciate Bernie Bros attacking the legendary John Lewis.
I'm sorry but what have I said that's been a lie? The Clinton's HAVE had a very negative effect on the black community and have expressed very anti-gay views in the past. Doesn't matter if Clinton was only the first lady, she was very active politically as first lady. It's not like she sat around picking which flowers to display in the Blue room during that time. She knew damn well she had her own political ambitions, hence why she ran for the Senate right after her husband left office.
And yes, there is a lack of research that's happened with Clinton supporters. If you're not dismissing every negative thing Hillary has done as being no big deal or "SHE'S CHANGED!!", you're trying to use Bernie's votes in the house on certain bills against him. Most bills in the house come in packages, this is a known fact. If he didn't vote for the Crime Bill, then you all would be using the fact he didn't support the Violence Against Women act that was also attached to that legislation. That's why he got in front of everyone and spoke out against that part of the bill. Do you all not know how the Senate works?
Quit trying to victimize yourselves all the time. You're all always so damn condescending, yet have the nerve to say the same thing about Sanders' supporters. You try acting like you're above all of it. Newsflash, you're not and that's evidenced by some of the crap a lot of Clinton supporters have come in here to say about Bernie. Not to mention the pathetic attempts at smearing Bernie by her own endorsers, which all backfired on them.
I have never once said that singled out a Sanders supporter on here or outside of ATRL as uneducated on their candidate (even when I shocked a Sanders supporter when I say he'd be the first Jewish president if he were to win). That is the most condescending thing you can do politically.
I have been reading about these two candidates since August to make sure I'm informed and many other people in this thread have done the same. Simply because we didn't reach the same conclusion as you or other Sanders supporters does not mean we're uneducated, it means we have different politics. And, in my mind, I happen to agree with what Hillary Clinton proposes and her methods to accomplish it over Sanders'.
Also, using the debunked claim of Hillary being very anti-gay not too long ago is just childish at this point. She marched in a gay pride parade while she was senator of New York. If you want to go to the same sex marriage issue, Bernie evolved on that issue and once claimed marriage was between a man and a woman. That issue is irrelevant and is over. Let it stay that way.
But in regards to the 1994 crime bill, I think it's silly to nail her for something only one of them actually voted for. "Tepid" support or not. In the books it was a vote and it contributed to its passage.
She was completely in favor of the bill
Bernie was against the prisons but he voted for it to pass the Violence Against Women Act and ban assault weapons. He's never changed his stance on that.
Bernie was against the prisons but he voted for it to pass the Violence Against Women Act and ban assault weapons. He's never changed his stance on that.
There's no argument that she was in support of it, as were the majority of Democrats at the time.
It doesn't matter why Bernie voted for it, he voted for it, period. If he was against the prisons piece enough he wouldn't have voted for it (like John Lewis, who voted against it). Apparently he wasn't against it enough to stop him from voting for it. You can't discount his vote just because his support was tepid.
There's no argument that she was in support of it, as were the majority of Democrats at the time.
It doesn't matter why Bernie voted for it, he voted for it, period. If he was against the prisons piece enough he wouldn't have voted for it (like John Lewis, who voted against it). Apparently he wasn't against it enough to stop him from voting for it. You can't discount his vote just because his support was tepid.
Regardless, he was against it while Hillary was for it. That is the fact.
Hillary was for it...but didn't vote at all on it...
I mean I guess
And he explained why he voted for it. Are you saying Hillary wouldn't have voted for it?
Just because a racist doesn't harm black people doesn't mean he's not a racist. You don't have to act on something to make it official. She was 100% for it and there's plenty of proof of this.
He also voted to fund the Iraq war because it included funding for Katrina victims. He was vehemently against the war but did what he had to do. This is the same "moderate" voting that people claim Bernie can't do.
If the crime bill didn't pass, the prison part of it would be considered the "afterthought" and people would be saying he's against the Violence Against Women Act and banning assault weapons.
Same with the Iraq War funding, he would be criticized for supposedly "refusing" to help out Katrina victims.
This is a big thing I hate about politics: bills, even good ones, have so much stuff added into them to either get the bill to pass or to get the things added in the bill to pass.
And he explained why he voted for it. Are you saying Hillary wouldn't have voted for it?
Just because a racist doesn't harm black people doesn't mean he's not a racist. You don't have to act on something to make it official. She was 100% for it and there's plenty of proof of this.
He also voted to fund the Iraq war because it included funding for Katrina victims. He was vehemently against the war but did what he had to do. This is the same "moderate" voting that people claim Bernie can't do.
It doesn't matter if he explained his reasoning for it, because of his vote the many detrimental affects it had on minorities came to be. That's like stealing medicine from a store and explaining you need it for your sick parents. It doesn't matter the reasoning, you did something wrong and then you're blaming others for it. And idc whether Hill possibly would or wouldn't support it, fact is she didn't vote in favor of it. The Crime Bill is literally one argument Bernie's supporters should drop , it doesn't look good for them as only one of them voted in favor of it!
