| |
News: Malaysia Air Ukraine crash: bodies on their way to NL
ATRL Contributor
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 59,202
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Mariah4life
The reason the first crash didn't make then go Bankrupt was because they never found the plane so there was no need to spend hundreds of millions to clean it up.  |
You seriously need to stop making this a joke... 
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 4/20/2012
Posts: 5,555
|
Quote:
Originally posted by NikkiFloresFan
I'm curious as to how that works because flying 1000 feet above the restriction makes no difference to someone on the ground looking up. I feel like you need to be required to be way above the restricted level.
|
That is exactly how it works. See, when a government establishes an area of restricted airspace due to government buildings, military bases, military training areas, etc... interception can only occur if the airspace is breached (usually with attempts to alert them of the error by scrambling fighters to guide them away for example). If they deem the breech to be intentional, or a threat then they may shoot it down.
In this case, the restricted airspace was established due to hostility. However, it does not restrict the hostility to within this airspace. A separatist group will not respect this, and it is up to those establishing the restriction to ensure that the zone covers the ALL hostile area.
A responsible airline would go the extra mile, as others have, whether through dispatch or other means to ensure that this area is further avoided. For various other unrelated reasons, flying 1000FT above restricted, hostile airspace ESPECIALLY while step-climbing is not a good idea.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 6/18/2012
Posts: 18,768
|
Quote:
Originally posted by JustLuke
You seriously need to stop making this a joke... |
You seriously need to stop thinking everything is a joke.
The person above said they wont go bankrupt. Not you
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/18/2013
Posts: 12,079
|
Quote:
Originally posted by reductive.
That is exactly how it works. See, when a government establishes an area of restricted airspace due to government buildings, military bases, military training areas, etc... interception can only occur if the airspace is breached (usually with attempts to alert them of the error by scrambling fighters to guide them away for example). If they deem the breech to be intentional, or a threat then they may shoot it down.
In this case, the restricted airspace was established due to hostility. However, it does not restrict the hostility to within this airspace. A separatist group will not respect this, and it is up to those establishing the restriction to ensure that the zone covers the ALL hostile area.
A responsible airline would go the extra mile, as others have, whether through dispatch or other means to ensure that this area is further avoided. For various other unrelated reasons, flying 1000FT above restricted, hostile airspace ESPECIALLY while step-climbing is not a good idea.
|
This would all be true if,
1) The airspace was restricted. Which it wasn't, in any way. Despite the other aggression taking place the past couple of days (Russia shot two Ukrainian planes down I think), the area was docile.
And
2) The plane was flying at 1k ft which it wasn't. It was flying 3k ft over the ground. This is the main reason every media outlet couldn't figure out if it was Russian rebels, terrorist or the Russian government themselves at work. Only the Russian government is suppose to have access to sophisticated weapons like the one used to shoot down the plane.
As far as Malaysia is concerned, their plane was flying in their right. That route was being done for months now. Neither the route nor the tension on the ground are new so something was clearly different about this plane and/or the timing of the aggression (which is very coincidental if you've been keeping up with the news).
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 7/22/2010
Posts: 14,605
|
I'm reading about the Ukraine-Russia conflict and Russia needs to sit and chill.
What kinda thirst for power? If they win and turn Ukraine into a federal state I'm sure they will try to do the same to other countries.
World domination mess.
|
|
|
|
ATRL Contributor
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 19,418
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Mariah4life
The reason the first crash didn't make then go Bankrupt was because they never found the plane so there was no need to spend hundreds of millions to clean it up. |
The airlines is owned by the Malaysian government which is why they don't get bankrupt.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 13,434
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Caesar
The airlines is owned by the Malaysian government which is why they don't get bankrupt.
|
This but I'm pretty sure sooner or later our government will privatize the company. Billions of taxpayers' money have been spent to save Malaysia Airlines since early 2000. I don't think our government want to keep it any longer
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 30,642
|
may they all rest in peace 
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 12/7/2011
Posts: 18,969
|
Rest in peace, and may justice be served.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 10/1/2011
Posts: 19,016
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Flare
This would all be true if,
1) The airspace was restricted. Which it wasn't, in any way. Despite the other aggression taking place the past couple of days (Russia shot two Ukrainian planes down I think), the area was docile.
And
2) The plane was flying at 1k ft which it wasn't. It was flying 3k ft over the ground. This is the main reason every media outlet couldn't figure out if it was Russian rebels, terrorist or the Russian government themselves at work. Only the Russian government is suppose to have access to sophisticated weapons like the one used to shoot down the plane.
As far as Malaysia is concerned, their plane was flying in their right. That route was being done for months now. Neither the route nor the tension on the ground are new so something was clearly different about this plane and/or the timing of the aggression (which is very coincidental if you've been keeping up with the news).
|
I don't think you know what you're talking about.
The airspace was closed and the plane flew 1k feet OVER the restricted airspace at 33k feet.
What reductive is saying is that YES the plane was allowed to be there technically, but it wasn't advisable and it should have been avoided in the first place.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 2/20/2012
Posts: 24,225
|
A missile?
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 10/1/2011
Posts: 19,016
|
Quote:
Originally posted by TikiMiss
|
Thank you for sharing. From what I've seen through this whole day it really is a bunch of different circumstances coming together in one unfortunate accident. 
|
|
|
|
Banned
Member Since: 6/4/2012
Posts: 1,953
|
that's horrible the passport they're showing so many kids My heart and prayers goes to them and their families
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 4/20/2012
Posts: 5,555
|
Quote:
Originally posted by Flare
This would all be true if,
1) The airspace was restricted. Which it wasn't, in any way. Despite the other aggression taking place the past couple of days (Russia shot two Ukrainian planes down I think), the area was docile.
And
2) The plane was flying at 1k ft which it wasn't. It was flying 3k ft over the ground. This is the main reason every media outlet couldn't figure out if it was Russian rebels, terrorist or the Russian government themselves at work. Only the Russian government is suppose to have access to sophisticated weapons like the one used to shoot down the plane.
As far as Malaysia is concerned, their plane was flying in their right. That route was being done for months now. Neither the route nor the tension on the ground are new so something was clearly different about this plane and/or the timing of the aggression (which is very coincidental if you've been keeping up with the news).
|
1. There was an airspace restriction in place. Here's a copy of the NOTAM:
Quote:
A1492/14 - TEMPO RESTRICTED AREA INSTALLED WITHIN FIR DNIPROPETROVSK
BOUNDED BY COORDINATES :
495355N 0380155E 485213N 0372209E 480122N 0370253E
471352N 0365856E 465018N 0374325E 465900N 0382000E
470642N 0381324E THEN ALONG STATE BOUNDARY
UNTIL POINT 495355N 0380155E.
RESTRICTION NOT APPLIED FOR FLIGHTS OF STATE ACFT OF UKRAINE. FL260 - FL320, 14 JUL 18:00 2014 UNTIL 14 AUG 23:59 2014 ESTIMATED. CREATED: 14 JUL 15:48 2014
|
The highlighted part means that between 26,000-32,000ft, within the established boundaries will be closed for one month starting on the 14th of July. They've since revised the NOTAM to include above 32,000ft, with no max height. (32000ft - Unlimited)
Quote:
|
FM FL320 UP TO UNL. 17 JUL 15:00 2014 UNTIL 17 AUG 23:59 2014 ESTIMATED. CREATED: 17 JUL 15:02 2014
|
The area was not docile, and the shooting down of the two other aircraft was reason enough for concern.
2) I didn't say that the aircraft was flying at 1000ft, it was flying at 33,000ft, 1000ft above the restriction of 32,000ft. Yes, the route if routine, not only for MAS but for other airlines operating routes across the region. But that did not stop other airlines from taking alternative routes in light of the recent events. Although there has been tension for months, it only recently escalated to separationists going after targets in the air.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 4/3/2014
Posts: 19,477
|
I work at a chain of gyms called Fitness First. They're the biggest gym chain in all of Australia. Anyway, I just got a text message saying "Hey Josh, it's Milly from Carlingford FF. I was just wondering if you could come in and cover for our receptionist and close tonight? One of our MC's (membership consultant) was in the plane that went down, and everyone's a bit shaken up/emotional that he's passed away."
Talk about 7 degrees of separation I know some of the people at the Carlingford club. I'm so tempted to ask who it was but I don't want to seem inappropriate 
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 31,895
|
RIP
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 8/31/2013
Posts: 9,758
|
Quote:
Originally posted by PoisonPill
It's completely the airline's fault. It was beyond negligent to not reroute their flight paths away from a conflict zone where 2 aircraft had been shot down in the past 3 days. Other airlines had rerouted their planes around the Ukraine-Russia border.
|
You're deluded as ****; try the mother****ers that shot the ****ing plane down? Maybe they are to blame hm????
I'm sorry but I seriously canNOT at people blaming the airline in any way
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 3/6/2014
Posts: 13,097
|
Quote:
Originally posted by NICHOLE
Completely off topic, but can someone who's informed on this educate me: could this ever happen to a US airline that is flying overseas into foreign territory? |
If its flying over a country where there's war going on, like Ukraine, than yes. This could have happened to any airline's flight.
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 27,856
|
This is such a tragic situation. I really feel for all the families right now.. Must be horrific
|
|
|
|
Member Since: 10/13/2010
Posts: 10,512
|
Damn, the Netherlands is in a huge state of morning.
Tv, radio, everybody is talking about it. Hearing families and emotional people on the radio is so sad.
|
|
|
|
|
|
