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Originally posted by Praise Mariallah
How are you completely missing the point? 
I Wanna Dance With Somebody was BIGGER than any Whitney ballad in the 80s. Why? Because the musical climate of the 80s sounded nothing like what it did in the 90s. |
IWDWS was bigger because Whitney's pop appeal had been fully established and it reaped the rewards. It didn't make anyone forget about her ballads, especially not GLOA. I already gave examples of GLOA being referenced in moments of pop culture.
I already established that the music of the 80s doesn't sound like the music of the 90s. That's because music is ALWAYS changing and that in no way refutes anything I said. Once again, I can use YOUR logic: IWALY sounded nothing like VOL. Same goes for UHB and MHWGO. So how are they part of a 90s trend started by VOL? Oh.
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Originally posted by Praise Mariallah
GLOA didn't start any trend, because not only did it predate IWDWS, but it did absolutely nothing to the musical climate/sound at the time in 86.
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The number of artists who started making music based on Whitney's blueprint say differently.
Quote:
Originally posted by Praise Mariallah
I'm sure you'll miss what I'm saying again so let me put it simpler:
GLOA did not start a musical trend of any sort in 1986. As evidenced by Whitney's very next single.
None of Whitney's singles in the 80s sounded anything like Vol or Emotions. When I say, "sound", I don't just mean sonically, but also the structure, the components. It is more than a reach to say VoL was a direct result of Whitney's 80s singles  |
I said VOL was SAID to sound like Whitney because it had similar vocal and musical feel to her own songs, not that it was a direct "result". WHITNEY HOUSTON, not GLOA, started the trend of BECAUSE of the vocal stylings and musical form of her ballads, SUCH AS GLOA. That's ONE ballad. Whitney had other ballads of a similar sweeping style, released AND unreleased.
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"She's a very classy lady and a very good singer with roots in gospel music that show through. She's bringing back ballads, and I'm glad she's around to do that."- (Brenda Lee on Whitney Houston) Brenda Lee hopes `Music!' will lead to Broadway, Chicago Sun-Times, February 26th, 1988
"I think it started with Whitney Houston," [Nancy Wilson] explains. "Not so much that she sounds like me but because the singer was being heard over the music again. We were hearing big ballads and great songs again. That helped pave the way for the rest."- Wilson, Ballad Back, The Washington Post: September 21st, 1990
"The way it is now, if it isn't a dance song or a love song that sounds like Whitney Houston, you're in trouble," says singer Jimmy Buffett."- DANCE VS ROCK THE MUSIC YOU CAN MOVE YOUR FEET TO IS GETTING ALL THE TOP 40 PLAY, The Boston Globe, August 26th, 1990
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Quote:
Originally posted by Praise Mariallah
IN THE 90s VoL set the trend of embroidering and lacing ballads with nothing but rococo melisma. It was at the very beginning OF THE 90s decade. Whitney's 80s SINGLES have absolutely nothing to do with, nor started any trend IN THE 90s. |
And you, again, are WRONG. Melisma had already been popularized. "Rococo" melisma had been used by many artists in popular music for decades.
Whitney's singles have EVERYTHING to do with music in the 90s. She created a blueprint with her music: sweeping, big ballads and virtuosic uptempos. The key changes, the big long modulations, the melismatic passages and gospel embellishments featured in Whitney's performances (studio AND live) had an immense effect on the industry. Execs went looking for the next Whitney Houston, told their own female singers to make songs and sing LIKE Whitney Houston. Stephanie Mills, Karyn White, Miki Howard, Wendy Moten, Taylor Dane, Vanessa Williams, Oleta Adams and so on, ALL were compared to Whitney Houston, either for following her blueprint musically or for similarities in vocal delivery.
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"In those early days, I was pushed and really pressured to be like Anita Baker and sing like Whitney Houston," Ferrell said. "They became prototypes and the managers and the labels wanted a return on their investment to guarantee a hit. But my stance was, 'You signed me for a reason. Can I just be me?'"- Rachelle Ferrell
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Originally posted by Praise Mariallah
You will list literally every singer pre 1970 to say they did something before Mariah, all the while I'm stressing that they did not do it the same way, or as complex.But, you'll list them anyway. |
Really? So tell me how Mariah's riffs exceed singers like Aretha in terms of rhythmic delivery, the following of the chord changes etc.
And critics cite Mariah and Whitney for increasing the USE and bombast of melisma rather than increasing the complexity.
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Originally posted by Praise Mariallah
The critics who say "Vision of Love is the Magna Carta of melisma" are absolutely 100% correct. You saying that they "could be", "probably are" or "might've been" the same people who call Elvis the first rock star ever is beyond irrelevant. |
They aren't. Because there is no "Magna Carta" of melisma. Melisma, in all its forms: simple, intermediate and complex, was already popular. Freddie Jackson, Whitney Houston, Luther Vandross, The Winans, The Clark Sisters, Aretha Franklin, Stevie Wonder, Anita Baker...ALL very well known for their ornate gospel/blues-ish melismas, embellishments, runs and decorations. It was already common in popular music BECAUSE of such singers with connections to the church, first established by the blues, jazz and gospel singers of old, spread out by the soul singers of the next generation, and then finally made commonplace by the black R&B and pop singers of the 80s who had great crossover appeal and success.
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Originally posted by Praise Mariallah
Literally point me to ANY song in Chaka's discography, or Minnie's, or Aretha's discography, or whoever else that shows the absolute mastery of melismatic patterned singing as VoL. That shows the versatility, the scaling, and the fluctuation. |
Check Aretha's ENTIRE discography lol. Check her performance of Amazing Grace, check the beginning riff in Young, Gifted and Black, her 1989 version of Think, It's Just Your Love, I Get High, Precious Lord from when she was just 12 years old.
I just....wow. Have you ever read music articles, reviews pre-1990? Or read books that talk about the black musical idiom? Melisma was used in all types of music, from gospel to country, at the time Mariah Carey hit the scene.
this is hard 
excuse me?