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Discussion: Why highly critically acclaimed gerls dont get popular?
Member Since: 5/11/2011
Posts: 1,999
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ace Reject
What you're not seeing is that a lot of these albums are not created to sell well.
POP STARS have to work in very set boundaries, with very set ideas of what melodies and chords work on radio. When something is too outside of the box, it fails. (See, radio never accepting Hold It Against Me, or Aaliyah's last album only finding success after her death).
But 70% of artists who make music have no intention of being pop stars. Not everyone wants to be a Jay or Bey, a Katy or Britney, a Kanye or Kings of Leon. Why force them to play in the same box as pop stars if that's not what they seek to do with their art?
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Bless you for this.
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Member Since: 6/1/2010
Posts: 65,177
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Let's put it like this... Soundscan isn't the end all be all. Critics isn't the end all be all. If you like something, then that's what you like.
Whether or not an artist becomes popular has more to do with marketing.
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Member Since: 7/3/2011
Posts: 10,425
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ace Reject
What you're not seeing is that a lot of these albums are not created to sell well.
POP STARS have to work in very set boundaries, with very set ideas of what melodies and chords work on radio. When something is too outside of the box, it fails. (See, radio never accepting Hold It Against Me, or Aaliyah's last album only finding success after her death).
But 70% of artists who make music have no intention of being pop stars. Not everyone wants to be a Jay or Bey, a Katy or Britney, a Kanye or Kings of Leon. Why force them to play in the same box as pop stars if that's not what they seek to do with their art?
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I can understand using different parameters for pop and indie acts, so I won't argue there.
But if that's how you feel, why do you seem to look down on pop acts that create finely crafted pop tunes? I honestly think artist like Ke$ha should be commended, because writing a song with strong hooks and great melodies that are loved by millions is a great achievement.
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Member Since: 1/9/2004
Posts: 9,558
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ace Reject
I'm just proud that I used absolutist correctly! Once you're out of school, all English skills you've acquired go out of the window without practice.  |
Atta Bart! Showing longetivity! 
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ATRL Moderator
Member Since: 2/19/2003
Posts: 34,484
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Quote:
Originally posted by Shame♥
Please don't think all Bey stans are this stupid.  |
You checking her? She thinks Check on It is that fire! IT spent five weeks at number one, after all.
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Member Since: 1/9/2004
Posts: 9,558
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Quote:
Originally posted by DejaVu
But if that's how you feel, why do you seem to look down on pop acts that create finely crafted pop tunes? I honestly think artist like Ke$ha should be commended, because writing a song with strong hooks and great melodies that are loved by millions is a great achievement.
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I'M. ABOUT. TO. GO. HAM. 
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ATRL Contributor
Member Since: 9/9/2010
Posts: 9,528
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Because "critics" aren't the only critics that matter. They have to have critical acclaim AND public interest, or even just public interest. That's just how the industry works.
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Member Since: 8/10/2010
Posts: 14,634
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Quote:
Originally posted by DejaVu
I can understand using different parameters for pop and indie acts, so I won't argue there.
But if that's how you feel, why do you seem to look down on pop acts that create finely crafted pop tunes? I honestly think artist like Ke$ha should be commended, because writing a song with strong hooks and great melodies that are loved by millions is a great achievement.
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Because it's generally not that hard nowadays. Look at all of the top singles of the past two years and tell me it's hard to create a catchy song. There seems to be three basic criterion: sex, electro-esque production, and instructing the public to throw their hands in the air.
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Member Since: 9/4/2011
Posts: 22,946
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If the public liked them they would chart and sell albums. 
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ATRL Moderator
Member Since: 2/19/2003
Posts: 34,484
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Quote:
Originally posted by DejaVu
I can understand using different parameters for pop and indie acts, so I won't argue there.
But if that's how you feel, why do you seem to look down on pop acts that create finely crafted pop tunes? I honestly think artist like Ke$ha should be commended, because writing a song with strong hooks and great melodies that are loved by millions is a great achievement.
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Well, most pop acts these days DON'T create their finely crafted pop tunes.
Let's see. Quality excepted (because that's subjective), how many POP stars are active authors in their music?
Gaga.
BEP/Will.I.Am.
Adele.
Taylor.
Bey.
Kanye.
Jay.
Chris Brown.
The rest - and this is not to be inflammatory! - have hitched their wagons to the worst of producer-driven pop (the two K's come to mind immediately) or, very admittedly/admirably don't need to have contributed anything but their essence to their music. (The two biggest examples of this had a certain R and B duet that topped the charts this year). Who's looking down on them? I'm not. (well, except for Mr. Brown ...)
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ATRL Moderator
Member Since: 2/19/2003
Posts: 34,484
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Quote:
Originally posted by V3$$3L.
I'M. ABOUT. TO. GO. HAM. |
Party Rock Anthem will outlive us all. 
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Member Since: 5/14/2009
Posts: 34,871
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Quote:
Originally posted by Gagasm
If the public liked them they would chart and sell albums. |
Not necessarily
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Member Since: 1/9/2004
Posts: 9,558
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If a by-the-numbers pop song resonates with its target audience - and doesn't transcend beyond its intended niche - it's not MORE of a triumph for being more ubiquitous than an equally worthy track without "a specific market" in mind, and said song falling on deaf ears.
Like...?
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ATRL Moderator
Member Since: 2/19/2003
Posts: 34,484
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Quote:
Originally posted by Gagasm
If the public liked them they would chart and sell albums. |
Most of them aren't here for the "public" liking them.
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Member Since: 10/5/2010
Posts: 11,469
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Quote:
Originally posted by Katie
It is a joke.  |
And so was my post.
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Member Since: 6/14/2011
Posts: 796
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OBVIOUSLY because their music doesn't have enough commercial appeal, it's as simple as that. No need to write an essay.
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Member Since: 7/3/2011
Posts: 10,425
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ace Reject
Well, most pop acts these days DON'T create their finely crafted pop tunes.
Let's see. Quality excepted (because that's subjective), how many POP stars are active authors in their music?
Gaga.
BEP/Will.I.Am.
Adele.
Taylor.
Bey.
Kanye.
Jay.
Chris Brown.
The rest - and this is not to be inflammatory! - have hitched their wagons to the worst of producer-driven pop (the two K's come to mind immediately) or, very admittedly/admirably don't need to have contributed anything but their essence to their music. (The two biggest examples of this had a certain R and B duet that topped the charts this year). Who's looking down on them? I'm not. (well, except for Mr. Brown ...)
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This is where we'll disagree again. Just cause an artist had very little to do with the crafting of a song doesn't mean they shouldn't be credited for it. Now we're going a bit offtopic again.
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Member Since: 6/1/2010
Posts: 65,177
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Quote:
Originally posted by Gagasm
If the public liked them they would chart and sell albums. |
...or in some cases, the public may not even know they exist... which boils down to marketing/promotion.
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Member Since: 5/25/2010
Posts: 23,013
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ace Reject
See! Maybe I should have been clear.
(Obviously this is my opinion, since I'm posting it.) I'm not talking about an album like Circus or Loud or anything a Disney starlet would release.
I'm talking about albums that aim for profundity and fall ludicrously short of their goals, like a Goodbye Lullaby or a Who We/You Are (can't be bothered to look up its actual title to be honest.)
And I hope you understand my last post about critics; I realize you're more likely to fall on the public's side - but since criticism is something I've studied and take quite seriously as an artist - it's vital for all artforms - naturally, I side with it. WHEN DONE WELL.  |
I understood your previous post, but it's a very generalized statement. Not here for that. But you added to my point with your above post. Avril Lavigne is a good example. Because Avril Lavigne is a blonde with pink and green streaks in her hair with a youthful demeanor, she's immediately written off by critics -- and people in general -- before an album is even released. Avril Lavigne sings as good as -- arguably better than -- Adele, is more versatile than Adele, and is overall more vocally interesting than Adele, but is not respected as much as Adele. Why is that? Because she's not in Oscar De La Renta gowns at awards with a mature, womanly image? Why is Taylor Swift's "Speak Now" more critically acclaimed than Avril Lavigne's "Goodbye Lullaby?" These are the questions I want people to ask.
...Vin
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Member Since: 9/4/2011
Posts: 22,946
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Quote:
Originally posted by Cap10Planet
...or in some cases, the public may not even know they exist... which boils down to marketing/promotion.
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I've seen albums marketed and promoed the **** out of and they continue to flop to hades 
I will remain stanning for a few flops but will not be dissuaded by their *lack of POP success 
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