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Discussion: U.S. Election 2016
ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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Quote:
Originally posted by Skywalker
True. You can even see this in countries that have room for third parties. I think it would help fringe people if they understood that the Democrats and Republicans aren't really one huge group - they're more like a coalition of a bunch of different political causes that unite for power. The progressives, the blue dogs, the labor unions. Republicans have their business elite, the fundamentalist Christian sect, the Freedom caucus, the Tea Party, etc.
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Right. The US could probably be argued to loosely posses coalition governments, but with a much stronger tendency to unite and to ideologically identify with that unification rather than a smaller entity.
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Member Since: 3/3/2011
Posts: 4,231
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I like the two party system. I look at the mess in European countries like Germany and France, where the system is put in place so there is rarely a majority government and parties must make coalitions to form governments. Reduces accountability, shackles a party platform, and creates a grey area for parties to deviate from their promises.
No democratic system is perfect, but in the two party system, in which each party operates as an umbrella for the left and the right, encompassing smaller groups that span the entire political spectrum, its as close to that I can imagine.
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Member Since: 12/29/2011
Posts: 1,932
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Glad East los Angeles came through
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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Quote:
Originally posted by Radiance
I like the two party system. I look at the mess in European countries like Germany and France, where the system is put in place so there is rarely a majority government and parties must make coalitions to form governments. Reduces accountability, shackles a party platform, and creates a grey area for parties to deviate from their promises.
No democratic system is perfect, but in the two party system, in which each party operates as an umbrella for the left and the right, encompassing smaller groups that span the entire political spectrum, its as close to that I can imagine.
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I also think it's easier to influence an entire party, and by extension the whole political process, from the inside with this system.
As a highly liberal and progressive person, I act as a force that is constantly pulling the Democratic party to the left - every single voter and party member is a similar force.
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Member Since: 8/3/2010
Posts: 71,871
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Quote:
Originally posted by Retro
I also think it's easier to influence an entire party, and by extension the whole political process, from the inside with this system.
As a highly liberal and progressive person, I act as a force that is constantly pulling the Democratic party to the left - every single voter and party member is a similar force.
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And it's people like you that need to stop polarizing the party. I'd rather pull the party right, go back to the old times 
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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Quote:
Originally posted by RatedG²
And it's people like you that need to stop polarizing the party. I'd rather pull the party right, go back to the old times |
**** that ****, New Democrat bull puckey. I stan for Hill, not Bill.
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Member Since: 8/6/2015
Posts: 3,624
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I can't believe Hillary won CA by 10 points. Whether they admit it or not, the media hyped up Bernie's chances of winning. He never, ever had a shot tbh
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Member Since: 8/3/2010
Posts: 71,871
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Quote:
Originally posted by Retro
**** that ****, New Democrat bull puckey. I stan for Hill, not Bill.
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Even more conservative than him! Think my baby JFK 
Quote:
Originally posted by HeyMr.DJ
I can't believe Hillary won CA by 10 points. Whether they admit it or not, the media hyped that up way too much tbh.
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 59,596
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Bernie's endorsement for Bill Clinton in 1996. I expect something just as firm but less harsh whenever he finally concedes, Hillary has done a lot more for modern liberal causes than Bill:
Quote:
In terms of who to support for president, the choice is really not difficult. I am certainly not a big fan of Bill Clinton’s politics. As a strong advocate of a single-payer health care system, I opposed his convoluted health care reform package. I have helped lead the opposition to his trade policies, which represent the interests of corporate America and which are virtually indistinguishable from the views of George Bush and Newt Gingrich. I opposed his bloated military budget, the welfare reform bill that he signed, and the so-called Defense of Marriage Act, which he supported. He has been weak on campaign finance reform and has caved in far too often on the environment. Bill Clinton is a moderate Democrat. I’m a democratic socialist.
Yet, without enthusiasm, I’ve decided to support Bill Clinton for president. Perhaps “support” is too strong a word. I’m planning no press conferences to push his candidacy, and will do no campaigning for him. I will vote for him, and make that public. Why? I think that many people do not perceive how truly dangerous the political situation in this country is today. If Bob Dole were to be elected president and Gingrich and the Republicans were to maintain control of Congress, we would see a legislative agenda unlike any in the modern history of this country. There would be an unparalleled war against working people and the poor, and political decisions would be made that could very well be irreversible.
Medicare and Medicaid would certainly be destroyed, and tens of millions more Americans would lose their health insurance. Steps would be taken to privatize Social Security, and the very existence of public education in America would be threatened. Serious efforts would be made to pass a constitutional amendment to ban abortion, affirmative action would be wiped out, and gay bashing would intensify. A flat tax would be passed, resulting in a massive shift in income from the working class to the rich, and all of our major environmental legislation would be eviscerated.
The Motor Voter bill would be repealed, and legislation making it harder for people to vote would be passed. Union-busting legislation would become law, the minimum wage would be abolished, and child labor would increase. Adults and kids in America would be competing for $3.00-an-hour jobs.
You think I’m kidding. You think I’m exaggerating. Well, I’m not. I work in Congress. I listen to these guys every day. They are very serious people. And the folks behind them, the Christian Coalition, the NRA, the Heritage Foundation, and others, are even crazier than they are. My old friend Dick Armey is not some wacko member of Congress laughed at by his colleagues. He is the Majority Leader of the U.S. House of Representatives. Check out his views. No. I do not want Bob Dole to be president. I’m voting for Bill Clinton.
Do I have confidence that Clinton will stand up for the working people of this country—for children, for the elderly, for the folks who are hurting? No, I do not. But a Clinton victory could give us some time to build a movement, to develop a political infrastructure to protect what needs protecting, and to change the direction of the country.
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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Quote:
Originally posted by RatedG²
Even more conservative than him! Think my baby JFK |
you're not even conservative you just think you are bc you think JFK was hot or something smh
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Member Since: 8/3/2010
Posts: 71,871
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Quote:
Originally posted by Skywalker
Bernie's endorsement for Bill Clinton in 1996. I expect something just as firm but less harsh whenever he finally concedes, Hillary has done a lot more for modern liberal causes than Bill:
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Wow where'd you find this? I expect something like this actually lol. He's made it perfectly clear he does not like Hill 
Quote:
Originally posted by Retro
you're not even conservative you just think you are bc you think JFK was hot or something smh
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Don't you backsash me! You don't know me! 
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Member Since: 8/19/2013
Posts: 2,514
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Member Since: 8/7/2015
Posts: 2,382
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Wait what if Bernie Sanders runs with the Green Party instead of endorse Hillary?  How likely is that to happen?
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Member Since: 5/27/2016
Posts: 4,241
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Quote:
Originally posted by Radiance
I like the two party system. I look at the mess in European countries like Germany and France, where the system is put in place so there is rarely a majority government and parties must make coalitions to form governments. Reduces accountability, shackles a party platform, and creates a grey area for parties to deviate from their promises.
No democratic system is perfect, but in the two party system, in which each party operates as an umbrella for the left and the right, encompassing smaller groups that span the entire political spectrum, its as close to that I can imagine.
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ATRL Senior Member
Member Since: 3/22/2012
Posts: 53,769
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Quote:
Originally posted by Eros
Its gonna be Warren.
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Yep.
Quote:
Originally posted by Jotham
Wait what if Bernie Sanders runs with the Green Party instead of endorse Hillary? How likely is that to happen?
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Very not likely. He'd be crucified by elected Dems.
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Member Since: 8/3/2010
Posts: 71,871
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Quote:
Originally posted by Eros
Its gonna be Warren.
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Any new reports out on it?
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 59,596
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Quote:
Originally posted by RatedG²
Wow where'd you find this? I expect something like this actually lol. He's made it perfectly clear he does not like Hill
Don't you backsash me! You don't know me! |
Well, Hillary is far more left and progressive than her husband. She's actually personally worked with Sanders for years and they are able to have a cordial relationship still despite how strained this is (Bernie congratulating Hillary at his rally despite knowing his fans hate her, Hillary taking the time to make the phone call and praise his efforts in her speech). Donald Trump is also so much more of a threat than Bob Dole, lmao. Not to mention he's going to be pushing for more progressive issues at the convention and being a little nice could go a long way in making that happen. He doesn't have to be dishonest but I don't think he'll be as harsh for those reasons. I think it is clear that Sanders does not want Trump as President more than anything else (as do all sane people).
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Banned
Member Since: 5/27/2016
Posts: 2,192
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There's no way I'm supporting either Trump or Hillary.
My support goes to Jill Stein.
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Member Since: 5/27/2016
Posts: 4,241
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See in theory a Warren ticket would placate the Bernie progressives and unite the party, but Sanders has fostered such a cult of personality that at this point I don't think Berniebros care about the issues at all, just identity politics.
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Member Since: 1/1/2014
Posts: 59,596
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I think some people are seeing Bernie's speech yesterday in the wrong light. Maybe it was the crowd? He was being very reconciliatory in his speech and mannerisms. He didn't end it but he knows it is over, he praised Obama and Clinton, and knows that unity is going to be important in this final stretch. It was a very different Sanders than we have seen in the past two or three months.
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